Prison system

ssj5 napa · 10-08-2005

What do you think the proper way to run a prison system is? Or, under what cercumstances (if any) do you think a death penalty should be given?

I really don't know how a jail should be run, but cramming hundreds of low lifes and murderers into one space doesn't seem to have great results. They kill eachother in jail, are still involved in crime, and often commit crime again when/if they get out.

I have a problem with the length of sentances, at least in Canada. A life sentance (here) is 20 years. So, if I broke into your house and beat you to death, I'd be out of jail in 20 years (max, I belive, unless I got several life sentances) and I'd be back on the street when I was 37. Shouldn't a 'life' sentance actually be..life?

I have mixed feelings about death penalties. I do think it's terrible that someone innocent could be executed for no reason, but then again I think someone that rapes and kills children should suffer like hell.

so...

**Ivan** · 10-08-2005

Take lives of those who took lives.

Kill them all, if you want. I don't really give a s**t. Holding people for life is a retarded thing to do, especially considering the families of the people they've done wrong to probably have sought out some form of consoling for what happened, and they won't ever find it.

As bad as it may seem, I'm sure people would find content with seeing the person they hate dying. I know I would.

SweetChild · 10-08-2005

Your right pepole kill another in jail but where else are they gonna put them.Anyway i dont belive in the death penalties I dont thik you should take the life of someone because they killed someone else I dont think anyone should have the right to kill anyone even if they had killed somone them self but thats just me I bet a million pepole would disagree.

**Ivan** · 10-08-2005

You can not believe in it all you want, but it's still going to happen.

Kill 'em.

.MacGyver · 10-08-2005

Killing is never a solution. They'll suffer more by sitting in jail, I would like that more. All of their lives, 20 years of their lives, it doesn't matter. Killing, nah, it's a relief for some people.

Mudering: Keep them locked up for life.

Raping: Cut off their balls.

Child molesting: Cut off their balls.

Beating someone: Lock that person up for 20 years. If the crime is being commited again, lock up for life.

Theft: Lock them up for life if they've been stealing more than three times.

Let them commit crimes to those of their own kind that deserve the treatment they get from their fellow prisoners. The only problem would be if someone was innocent, but that's a problem that always will exist.

.Mr. Mystery? · 10-08-2005

All in all the prison system is a ridiculous idea. Storing rapists and murderers all in the same space? And it rarely "heals" them - Some get out and snatch the first person they see on the parking lot. I believe prison to be traumatizing for life, but it doesn't cure criminals. Just as detention doesn't cure irresponsible students.

As for an alternative, Hammurab's "eye for an eye" -law is too cruel, and in violation of human rights. Killing a murderer makes you just as bad, even if it was in revenge. (This topic actually closely skims by the war one)

I don't believe in life sentences - He may've made a horrible thing in his youth that he regrets at an older age, but - "Sorry pal, it's life sentence for you" - Imagine that. Sentences for your whole life seems turkish-fascism. You should be paid for your crimes, but the bottom line is still just to stop crime. Also it wouldn't work considering the years well-behaving cons can reduce their sentence with these days. Plus, prisons don't have room to store people for life for all homicides that take place - They're already bursting with convicts.

If you've ever seen the movie "A Clockwork Orange", it's got a futuristic solution for "curing" criminals. The Ludovico Treatment means forcing the convict to watch violent films, while making him sick with different liquids - The con thus connects the horrible feeling to violence, and is incapable of doing anything violent without experiencing a feeling of death. This is utopistic and almost impossible to realize - In reality also very unsure. The example fit the topic.

I am against capitol punishment, except with the most serious and outrageous of crimes (for example serious child-abusers, massmurderers and important political criminals [like Osama and Saddam]) I believe that seeing the killer of your loved one die gives you no alleviation whatsoever - It'll just slowly eat your intestants out all the more. I believe seeing his eyes go white would only leave a hole inside you, when you'd have no one alive to unload your hate on. Going capitol on his murdering ass won't bring your close one back, and give no ease on the pain. That's my opinion.

System of a Down - Prison Song

They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,

Following the rights movements
You clamped down with your iron fists,
Drugs became conveniently
Available for all the kids,
Following the rights movements
You clamped down with your iron fists,
Drugs became conveniently
Available for all the kids,

I buy my crack, my smack, my b***h
right here in Hollywood.

Nearly 2 million Americans are incarcerated
In the prison system, prison system of the U.S.

They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in)
Another prison system,
Another prison system,
Another prison system. (for you and me)

Minor drug offenders fill your prisons
You don't even flinch
All our taxes paying for your wars
Against the new non-rich,
Minor drug offenders fill your prisons
You don't even flinch
All our taxes paying for your wars
Against the new non-rich,

I buy my crack, my smack, my b***h
right here in Hollywood.

The percentage of Americans in the prison system
prison system, has doubled since 1985,

They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in)
Another prison system,
Another prison system,
Another prison system. (for you and me)

FOR YOU AND I! YOU AND I! YOU AND I!
You and I.

They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
For you and me,
Oh baby, you and me.

All research and successful drug policy show
That treatment should be increased,
And law enforcement decreased,
While abolishing mandatory minimum sentences,
All research and successful drug policy show
That treatment should be increased,
And law enforcement decreased,
While abolishing mandatory minimum sentences.

Utilizing drugs to pay for secret wars around the world,
Drugs are now your global policy,
Now you police the globe,

I buy my crack, my smack, my b***h
right here in Hollywood.

Drug money is used to rig elections,
And train brutal corporate sponsored
Dictators around the world.

They're trying to build a prison

They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in)
Another prison system,
Another prison system,
Another prison system. (for you and me)
FOR YOU AND I! YOU AND I! YOU AND I!
You and I.
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
They're trying to build a prison,
For you and me,
Oh baby, you and me.

Wow, this turned out to be longer than I thought. Apparently I did have some opinions about this..

.MacGyver · 10-08-2005

I don't know if I missed it or not, but what would one do about criminals then, Supreme Gohan? Maybe putting them inot Clockwork Orange treatment? (I've read the book) That would be good, I guess, but if the person change, and then get's attacked by someone, he can't defence himself. Maybe the prisoners today have too grat contact with eachoter which encourages them to continue with their crimes. I dunno, I've never been in prison or done anything criminal, so I don't really know how it really works...

Bloodyhawk · 10-09-2005

The only problem about Capital Punishment is what if they get the wrong person? if somone got a life sentence instead or the death punishment and then they figure out that it was somone else and the person they put in jail was innocent then they can always be released. They cant turn back once you kill somone.

.Fallen-One · 10-09-2005

Life sentence in Canada is actually 25 years instead of 20(yay for Canadian Law class).

.MacGyver · 10-09-2005

In Sweden the longest prison penalty ever given under the name "life sentence" was 12 years last time I heard. Normally it's shorter though.

ssj5 napa · 10-09-2005

Clockwork orange is an amazing book and movie, but didn't you notice the treatment doesn't work? lol

hm, I'm thinking maybe jails should have all the convicts in solitude cells. Just leave them in their own cell, that way they don't keep associating with sickos, or killing and raping eachother.

.Mr. Mystery? · 10-09-2005

QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 04:40 PM)
I don't know if I missed it or not, but what would one do about criminals then, Supreme Gohan? Maybe putting them inot Clockwork Orange treatment? (I've read the book)

Hah, I don't have a good solution for this - But I know a better solution exists. (That doesn't help anyone, does it?) Maybe lobotomy for all of them?

QUOTE(SSJ5 Napa @ Oct 8 2005, 11:23 PM)
Clockwork orange is an amazing book and movie, but didn't you notice the treatment doesn't work? lol

hm, I'm thinking maybe jails should have all the convicts in solitude cells. Just leave them in their own cell, that way they don't keep associating with sickos, or killing and raping eachother.

Yep, it didn't work - And I wouldn't trust it in real life either. Alex was pretty thoroughly twisted, though..And solitude cells would be a minor solution - The cons still take showers and walks outside. You can't be safe in prison. And the don't have the room to give every criminal their own cell - Prisons are already packed, and getting more long-timers all the time.

The finnish life sentence is about 12 years too, but can be reduced with good behavior (and usually is).

.MacGyver · 10-09-2005

I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes.

There has to be a better way. Labour camp.

Just kidding.

.Mr. Mystery? · 10-09-2005

QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 11:49 PM)
I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes.

? There isn't a part like that in either the movie or the book.

And labor camp is as good of a solution as lobotomy. It's easy to say the system blows, but not to think of a better one.

.MacGyver · 10-09-2005

QUOTE(Supreme Gohan @ Oct 8 2005, 11:41 PM)
QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 11:49 PM)
I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes.

? There isn't a part like that in either the movie or the book.

And labor camp is as good of a solution as lobotomy. It's easy to say the system blows, but not to think of a better one.

[snapback]477111[/snapback]

I remember there is a part that's something like that, at least in the version I read in the school.
Well, there isn't really any good ways that can replace the prison system of today though. Can't think of anything new by myself, in my ears labour camp sounds the best since the prisoners can pay off their debt to society by that.

10-08-2005	#1 (permalink)
ssj5 napa (19) Mastered Super Saiyan Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,111 Rep Power: 6	Prison system What do you think the proper way to run a prison system is? Or, under what cercumstances (if any) do you think a death penalty should be given? I really don't know how a jail should be run, but cramming hundreds of low lifes and murderers into one space doesn't seem to have great results. They kill eachother in jail, are still involved in crime, and often commit crime again when/if they get out. I have a problem with the length of sentances, at least in Canada. A life sentance (here) is 20 years. So, if I broke into your house and beat you to death, I'd be out of jail in 20 years (max, I belive, unless I got several life sentances) and I'd be back on the street when I was 37. Shouldn't a 'life' sentance actually be..life? I have mixed feelings about death penalties. I do think it's terrible that someone innocent could be executed for no reason, but then again I think someone that rapes and kills children should suffer like hell. so... __________________

10-08-2005	#2 (permalink)
Ivan Moderator Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Halcyon Posts: 3,273 Rep Power: 131	Prison system Take lives of those who took lives. Kill them all, if you want. I don't really give a s**t. Holding people for life is a retarded thing to do, especially considering the families of the people they've done wrong to probably have sought out some form of consoling for what happened, and they won't ever find it. As bad as it may seem, I'm sure people would find content with seeing the person they hate dying. I know I would. __________________ Brawl Tournament Discussion/Match-ups/Betting Brawl Tournament Topic

10-08-2005	#3 (permalink)
SweetChild (16) Master of Kaio-ken Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 524 Rep Power: 4	Prison system Your right pepole kill another in jail but where else are they gonna put them.Anyway i dont belive in the death penalties I dont thik you should take the life of someone because they killed someone else I dont think anyone should have the right to kill anyone even if they had killed somone them self but thats just me I bet a million pepole would disagree.

10-08-2005	#4 (permalink)
Ivan Moderator Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Halcyon Posts: 3,273 Rep Power: 131	Prison system You can not believe in it all you want, but it's still going to happen. Kill 'em. __________________ Brawl Tournament Discussion/Match-ups/Betting Brawl Tournament Topic

10-08-2005	#5 (permalink)
.MacGyver (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,217 Rep Power: 5	Prison system Killing is never a solution. They'll suffer more by sitting in jail, I would like that more. All of their lives, 20 years of their lives, it doesn't matter. Killing, nah, it's a relief for some people. Mudering: Keep them locked up for life. Raping: Cut off their balls. Child molesting: Cut off their balls. Beating someone: Lock that person up for 20 years. If the crime is being commited again, lock up for life. Theft: Lock them up for life if they've been stealing more than three times. Let them commit crimes to those of their own kind that deserve the treatment they get from their fellow prisoners. The only problem would be if someone was innocent, but that's a problem that always will exist.

10-08-2005	#6 (permalink)
.Mr. Mystery? (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,228 Rep Power: 5	Prison system All in all the prison system is a ridiculous idea. Storing rapists and murderers all in the same space? And it rarely "heals" them - Some get out and snatch the first person they see on the parking lot. I believe prison to be traumatizing for life, but it doesn't cure criminals. Just as detention doesn't cure irresponsible students. As for an alternative, Hammurab's "eye for an eye" -law is too cruel, and in violation of human rights. Killing a murderer makes you just as bad, even if it was in revenge. (This topic actually closely skims by the war one) I don't believe in life sentences - He may've made a horrible thing in his youth that he regrets at an older age, but - "Sorry pal, it's life sentence for you" - Imagine that. Sentences for your whole life seems turkish-fascism. You should be paid for your crimes, but the bottom line is still just to stop crime. Also it wouldn't work considering the years well-behaving cons can reduce their sentence with these days. Plus, prisons don't have room to store people for life for all homicides that take place - They're already bursting with convicts. If you've ever seen the movie "A Clockwork Orange", it's got a futuristic solution for "curing" criminals. The Ludovico Treatment means forcing the convict to watch violent films, while making him sick with different liquids - The con thus connects the horrible feeling to violence, and is incapable of doing anything violent without experiencing a feeling of death. This is utopistic and almost impossible to realize - In reality also very unsure. The example fit the topic. I am against capitol punishment, except with the most serious and outrageous of crimes (for example serious child-abusers, massmurderers and important political criminals [like Osama and Saddam]) I believe that seeing the killer of your loved one die gives you no alleviation whatsoever - It'll just slowly eat your intestants out all the more. I believe seeing his eyes go white would only leave a hole inside you, when you'd have no one alive to unload your hate on. Going capitol on his murdering ass won't bring your close one back, and give no ease on the pain. That's my opinion. System of a Down - Prison Song They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, Following the rights movements You clamped down with your iron fists, Drugs became conveniently Available for all the kids, Following the rights movements You clamped down with your iron fists, Drugs became conveniently Available for all the kids, I buy my crack, my smack, my b*h right here in Hollywood. Nearly 2 million Americans are incarcerated In the prison system, prison system of the U.S. They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in) Another prison system, Another prison system, Another prison system. (for you and me) Minor drug offenders fill your prisons You don't even flinch All our taxes paying for your wars Against the new non-rich, Minor drug offenders fill your prisons You don't even flinch All our taxes paying for your wars Against the new non-rich, I buy my crack, my smack, my bh right here in Hollywood. The percentage of Americans in the prison system prison system, has doubled since 1985, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in) Another prison system, Another prison system, Another prison system. (for you and me) FOR YOU AND I! YOU AND I! YOU AND I! You and I. They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, For you and me, Oh baby, you and me. All research and successful drug policy show That treatment should be increased, And law enforcement decreased, While abolishing mandatory minimum sentences, All research and successful drug policy show That treatment should be increased, And law enforcement decreased, While abolishing mandatory minimum sentences. Utilizing drugs to pay for secret wars around the world, Drugs are now your global policy, Now you police the globe, I buy my crack, my smack, my b*h right here in Hollywood. Drug money is used to rig elections, And train brutal corporate sponsored Dictators around the world. They're trying to build a prison They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, (for you and me to live in) Another prison system, Another prison system, Another prison system. (for you and me) FOR YOU AND I! YOU AND I! YOU AND I! You and I. They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, They're trying to build a prison, For you and me, Oh baby, you and me. Wow, this turned out to be longer than I thought. Apparently I did* have some opinions about this..

10-08-2005	#7 (permalink)
.MacGyver (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,217 Rep Power: 5	Prison system I don't know if I missed it or not, but what would one do about criminals then, Supreme Gohan? Maybe putting them inot Clockwork Orange treatment? (I've read the book) That would be good, I guess, but if the person change, and then get's attacked by someone, he can't defence himself. Maybe the prisoners today have too grat contact with eachoter which encourages them to continue with their crimes. I dunno, I've never been in prison or done anything criminal, so I don't really know how it really works...

10-09-2005	#8 (permalink)
Bloodyhawk (18) Artificial Human Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 903 Rep Power: 6	Prison system The only problem about Capital Punishment is what if they get the wrong person? if somone got a life sentence instead or the death punishment and then they figure out that it was somone else and the person they put in jail was innocent then they can always be released. They cant turn back once you kill somone. __________________

10-09-2005	#9 (permalink)
.Fallen-One (13) Great Ape Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 295 Rep Power: 5	Prison system Life sentence in Canada is actually 25 years instead of 20(yay for Canadian Law class).

10-09-2005	#10 (permalink)
.MacGyver (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,217 Rep Power: 5	Prison system In Sweden the longest prison penalty ever given under the name "life sentence" was 12 years last time I heard. Normally it's shorter though.

10-09-2005	#11 (permalink)
ssj5 napa (19) Mastered Super Saiyan Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,111 Rep Power: 6	Prison system Clockwork orange is an amazing book and movie, but didn't you notice the treatment doesn't work? lol hm, I'm thinking maybe jails should have all the convicts in solitude cells. Just leave them in their own cell, that way they don't keep associating with sickos, or killing and raping eachother. __________________

10-09-2005	#12 (permalink)
.Mr. Mystery? (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,228 Rep Power: 5	Prison system QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 04:40 PM) I don't know if I missed it or not, but what would one do about criminals then, Supreme Gohan? Maybe putting them inot Clockwork Orange treatment? (I've read the book) Hah, I don't have a good solution for this - But I know a better solution exists. (That doesn't help anyone, does it?) Maybe lobotomy for all of them? QUOTE(SSJ5 Napa @ Oct 8 2005, 11:23 PM) Clockwork orange is an amazing book and movie, but didn't you notice the treatment doesn't work? lol hm, I'm thinking maybe jails should have all the convicts in solitude cells. Just leave them in their own cell, that way they don't keep associating with sickos, or killing and raping eachother. Yep, it didn't work - And I wouldn't trust it in real life either. Alex was pretty thoroughly twisted, though..And solitude cells would be a minor solution - The cons still take showers and walks outside. You can't be safe in prison. And the don't have the room to give every criminal their own cell - Prisons are already packed, and getting more long-timers all the time. The finnish life sentence is about 12 years too, but can be reduced with good behavior (and usually is).

10-09-2005	#13 (permalink)
.MacGyver (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,217 Rep Power: 5	Prison system I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes. There has to be a better way. Labour camp. Just kidding.

10-09-2005	#14 (permalink)
.Mr. Mystery? (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,228 Rep Power: 5	Prison system QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 11:49 PM) I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes. ? There isn't a part like that in either the movie or the book. And labor camp is as good of a solution as lobotomy. It's easy to say the system blows, but not to think of a better one.

10-09-2005	#15 (permalink)
.MacGyver (20) Super Saiyan 2 Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,217 Rep Power: 5	Prison system QUOTE(Supreme Gohan @ Oct 8 2005, 11:41 PM) QUOTE(MacGyver @ Oct 8 2005, 11:49 PM) I know the treatment didn't work, but initially it gave good results. Until Alex pushed that man down pretending he would clean his shoes. ? There isn't a part like that in either the movie or the book. And labor camp is as good of a solution as lobotomy. It's easy to say the system blows, but not to think of a better one. [snapback]477111[/snapback] I remember there is a part that's something like that, at least in the version I read in the school. Well, there isn't really any good ways that can replace the prison system of today though. Can't think of anything new by myself, in my ears labour camp sounds the best since the prisoners can pay off their debt to society by that.