Eye of the Tiger

Is Madara, as we see him now, weaker or stronger than he was when he fought the First Hokage?

I believe he was stronger, but only because of Kyuubi.

But in summonless battle, I think the current Madara is stronger than the young one.

Why?

Besides Madara now having 100+ years more experience (should make up for his weakened body) and being able to survive Amaterasu now, this:

Indication of Madara being weaker now:
The only indication of Madara now being weaker than he was when he fought First Hokage is that Itachi said "Madara is now a shell of his former self. I will take your eyes, Sasuke, and become the most powerful Uchiha". But Itachi told a lot of lies, and really, how would Itachi know how powerful Madara was back in time? The indication of Madara being weaker now is based on a lier's words, and even one who couldn't know what he is talking about.

Indication of Madara being stronger now:
First Hokage was more powerful than Young Madara. Third Hokage was a lot more powerful than First Hokage. Orochimaru was slightly more powerful than Third Hokage. Itachi is a lot more powerful than Orochimaru. So...
Young Madara < First Hokage <<< Third Hokage < Orochimaru <<< Itachi.
Actual FIGHTING completely contradicts the TALKING (which came from a lier), placing Itachi leagues above Young Madara. Yet, Itachi and Old Madara hated each other, but neither wanted to take shots at each other, indicating they were in the same league of power.

Conclusion
Young Madara WAS the most powerful, because he got the Kyuubi. First Hokage just had the perfect counter against Kyuubi, making him the only one able to defeat Young Madara. And he did, Young Madara losing Kyuubi. So, in the end, Old Madara is a lot more powerful than Young Madara, but Young Madara WAS more powerful when he had the Kyuubi.

Final Ultima

No, Madara now would be stronger than the past!

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Eye of the Tiger

And Madara IS stronger than the Madara in the past... AFTER he lost the Kyuubi!

Final Ultima

Yep! We are talking individual strength here.

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Nikushimi

Madara is indeed stronger now than he was before.

Young Madara came from a time of constant strife, when the Uchiha clan wasn't associated with any one vilalge. They were a clan of mercenaries hired by other countries most commonly to combat the Senju clan. There was little or no sophisticated military structure.

Really, all Madara had were some hax eyes and a ferocious pet. However, as Zetsu put it, the eyes are just a weapon; a novice with a shuriken can be beaten by an expert with a rock. Shodai, on the other hand, had all eight of the other Bijuu under his control, which I'm sure made fighting the Kyuubi a relatively easy task.

Now, indeed, some will point to the "pathetic shell" remark made by Itachi and say that Madara is in fact weaker. But I would like you to direct your attention to this page from the manga:

Naruto Manga Returns

There can be no more doubt. The same man who called him a pathetic shell of his former self, within the very same chapter (in fact, before calling him a pathetic shell in the first place) stated that he remained "alive and well, as do his eyes and their power." Madara has not gotten weaker. In fact, he has gotten stronger. It's been well over 60 years. He hasn't been sitting around with his thumbs up his ass, he's been reaching and grasping for greater power.

Shodai's Edo Tensei incarnation couldn't defeat Sandaime Hokage, even with the help of Nidaime. Granted that Shodai was without his Bijuu army and could not think clearly in that state...that is ALL he lacked. His Ninjutsu potency was not hindered, as far as we know. Nothing was glaringly, horribly wrong with his physical skills. But even then, he had virtual immortality and could not be hurt. Honestly, Shodai voluntarily gave up his Bijuu army when he distributed them throughout the nations to balance the scales of power. Shodai himself did not increase or decrease in power as a result, yet still, Sandaime Hokage was considered greater than him, and proved it in battle.

One more thing I would like to add, is that having powerful summons does not mean you are going to win. Naruto could've just summoned Gamabunta right off the bat and steamrolled over Kimimaro to get to Sasuke, but did he? No. Base Kimimaro had him shitting bricks as he watched his clone army get picked apart right before his eyes. Unless Shodai summoned his Bijuu Armada immediately in a confrontation with someone like, say...Itachi...he would be wiped off the map in the most humiliating rapestomp the Narutoverse has ever seen. Even WITH his Bijuu summoned, nothing is stopping someone of Itachi's calibre from simply speedblitzing, bypassing the summon, and attacking Shodai directly.

Another fact to take into account is that Shodai had Bijuu suppression powers, and the Kyuubi was affected by this. It's just that everyone found out about Shodai beating Madara and immediately assumed that Shodai must be some kind of god. This is not true. Young Madara was less powerful and less skilled than current Madara. He's a perfect example of someone who has power that they lack adequate experience to handle. I mean, honestly. He obtained his eyes by taking them from his brother, he didn't train for them or anything. How he obtained the Kyuubi is also an unknown, but it had no direct affect on his own power to have a summon backing him up.

So it's over. Current Madara>Shodai>Young Madara.

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Oldboy

Logically Madara should have gotten alot stronger in time, he had like 100 years to practice. On the other hand Itachi calls him "pathetic shell of his former self" Itachi could be very well referring to his ambitions and ideals or some other shit.

Besides we had seen a glimpse of his potential when he met the Leaf party. He toyed with em and left by waving his hand. I doubt any shinobi(except Itachi) could do such thing.

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LegendaryBroli

As much as I hate to disagree, I have to disagree. I mean people think he spent all these trainning and fighting I beg to differ if you think about it only as Tobi did he go on certain missions and when he faced off with naruto he just telported around instead of actually fighting. Plus lets not forget he probably thinks he's this big and bad dude that nobody can beat him.

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Final Ultima

You forgot to mention Madara >>>Itachi!

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Munboy Dracule O'Brian

Madara Uchiha is likely stronger now due to the fact he has had years to improve, also that space-time Ninjutsu and that body hardening jutsu are jutsu he likely didn't have in the past.

And for the sake of the plot at this point Madara has to be stronger then Hashirama though if he isn't the power up he'll probably get will make him stronger.

Nikushimi

Only current Madara is stronger than Itachi, and it's only by a hair's breadth. If they fought, it would be almost dead-even, and Itachi could kill him with just a bit of PnJ.

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Munboy Dracule O'Brian

Itachi stated himself he cannot take Madara with out the Eternal Mangekyou Sharingan therefore ether Madara could take Itachi.

Imihsukin

I am not sure how I see this actually. It would seem with him being around for so long that he could have only gotten stronger, but then Itachi refers to him as a pathetic shell of his former self. This could just be in relation to his view on things, or just propaganda to try and further separate Sasuke from his grasp.

He already had him EMS back then and Itachi admitted inferiority, so I would assume no matter which version we look at, he would be stronger.

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Final Ultima

Madara is stronger than Itachi. Itachi would lose either way cause plot says so.

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