Majuub

Ok, according to you, Full power SSJ3 Goku>Chibi Buu>
I'll make it simple, I have tons of points but I'll start with them.
Goku was affraid of fighting Shin Buu when he was with Vegeta, he said both of them would get killed if they were to batlle him. However, he was excited at the thought of fighting Chibi Buu and was even happy because he lost power. Goku even said: What a chane, I think we can take him now. This basically proves. Chou Gohan was able to beat the crap out of the same Buu Goku was affraid of. That basically proves.
Chou Gohan>Shin Buu>SSJ3 Goku>Chibi Buu

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Michael_Myers

That's right

Feel free to start with whatever you like

That's because of their size.Goku even says "like this". They were smaller than a flea and in those circumstances, if they got outside, they would have no chance to defeat Super Boo.
That's because the underestimated him when they first saw him, due to his size . Goku later says that he doesn't know if he can do anything against him and that he would have to go all out against him to have a chance. Not to mention that even Vegeta later says that he is a lot stronger than he thought.
Then there's also the fact that when Mr Boo was removed from Super Boo and "Buff" Boo appeared, it was Kid Boo's power all along that was displayed because he had no other source from where he could that strong due to the fact that Mr Boo was already disconected.

So no, you haven't proven anything.

Majuub

Gokuu wasn't refering to their size but to the fact that they weren't fused. He even suggested the fusion a few times because he knew they weren't strong enough. Even when Shin Buu was in his own body talking to them, Goku said with fake confidence that they would have to kill him before getting out of there, Shin Buu knew their strength and said they wouldn't be able to win, and that they would be the ones who would get killed.
Vegeta had underestimated him, he even said, look, he shrank. Goku just said, what a chance, we might beat him AFTER ALL. Meaning Chibi Buu actually is weaker than Shin Buu. To say Buff Buu is Chibi Buu's power is somewhat true and somewhat untrue. When they ripped Fat Buu from Shin Buu, Shin Buu reverted to his original form, going through Buff Buu, the stage he took after absorbing the south Kaioshin. The reason he reverted to him was probabily because he still had memories of his past and went through this process, for all we know, when Buu absorbs Kaios they affect him completely differently from other living beings, I wouldn't be suprised if he indeed reverted back to Buff Buu just for that. Why didn't he reverted back to the state when he absorbed the Dai Kaioshin? Simply because Mr Buu had still the gentle side within him. Yes, they said his Ki was rising but right after Goku said they could take him because his Ki was weaker, it's not like Goku can't sense someone's Ki, for Vegeta to underestimate someone it's normal, but for Goku, it's another story.

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Michael_Myers

Goku says "like this" which means in their condition which was both smaller than a flea and unfused. The fact that he insinuates later on when Super Boo is at the same size as them that they will beat him and find a way out further strenghtens my point.

Both Goku and Vegeta underestimated him, thus the later statements that I presented you. As for when Super Boo reverted to his original form, you missed my point completly. When Buff Boo appared, Mr Boo was already disconected from Kid Boo. There wasn't a source from where Kid Boo could get the necesarry power to transform into Buff Boo thus it was his power all along that was displayed when Goku and Vegeta noticed that his ki was increasing when transforming from Super Boo to Buff Boo.

Majuub

I'll say it again, he even suggested fusion twice. Goku said that with fake confidence, Vegeta ripped off Fat Buu from Shin Buu because he knew that would somehow make him weaker than he his and at this state they would stand a chance.
For all we know, Buu retains memories from his past in all forms, that's why he reverted back to Buff Buu without Fat Buu, it's because his mind already went through that process in the past, it's the only logical way for that to happen. His power was increasing, indeed. It decreased right after because Goku and Vegeta said it was increasing, and after they said they could take him, meaning they could sense his Ki rising but they also could sense his Ki weakening. Or are you telling me that suddenly, they lost the abilty to sens Ki.
Goku said Gotenks was stronger than him, he said that before Gotenks went in the ROSAT(Room of spirit and time), he was confident in the fact that Gotenks could take on Fat Buu in his SSJ state, meaning Gotenks Pre ROSAT and Goku are about even according to Goku himself. Gotenks then trained in the ROSAT and achieved a new level of power, he was now much stronger as an SSJ than before, meaning, if Goku was exaggerating Gotenks's power before, Gotenks was now way stronger, at least equal to SSJ3 Goku. Gotenks tried to fight Shin Buu as in his base form and in his SSJ form, he was clearly much weaker than Shin Buu in both forms. Then Gotenks showed he was powerful enough to go SSJ3, by now, Goku was impressed, and by now, Gotenks was clearly in a level far above SSJ3 Goku. Gotenks had a hard time fighting Shin Buu but he still manage to have the upper hand, he was stronger than Shin Buu but not by much, it was a blow for blow fight. The elder Kai said earlier that he could make Gohan the strongest fighter in the universe, he even said that in front of Goku who didn't contradict him. Later Gohan got his potential unlocked, and they said many times in the series that Gohan had a much higher potential than Goku, the elder Kai even said that he would make Gohan stronger than Gohan could have ever been, meaning he would not only make Gohan unlock his full potential but he would make him even stronger. That same Gohan was beating Shin Buu easily, and Goku was affraid to fight that same Shin Buu. If SSJ3 Gotenks who is a lot stronger than Goku by Goku's own admission is a little stronger than Shin Buu but much weaker than Chou Gohan it means Goku is weaker than Shin Buu and much weaker than Chou Gohan. Therefore:
Chou Gohan>>>SSJ3 Gotenks>Shin Buu>>SSJ Gotenks Post ROSAT>SSJ3 Goku>=SSJ Gotenks Pre ROSAT

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Shaka of virgo

You are almost right except in Goku has no idea how the fusion is turn out to be, first when Piccolo ask if they might use the room Goku said they might need it later



Acording with how Piccolo see, Gotenks SSJ1 power Piccolo is not so sure.



Goku SSJ 3 is more than what he show against fat Buu.

I agree SSJ 3 Gotenks is superior to Goku SSJ3, but not SSJ Gotenks, the rest of your list is right.

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Train hard and enjoy life, that is the Muten Roshi way.

Michael_Myers

He suggested fusion because in those circumstances, give the size they were, they wouldn't be able to defeat Super Boo thus the fusion was the only way they could have improved their chances. And no, Goku didn't say it with "fake" confidence, he obviously insinuated that he can beat Super Boo while they are at the same size and afterwards he would find a way out.

You either don't understand my point or just flat out ignore it. My point was that after Mr Boo was removed from Super Boo's body there was no other source from where "Buff Boo"'s power could come from except Kid Boo, thus the power that was displayed was Kid Boo's power all along.
Goku never stated directly stated that Gotenks was stronger than him, and he also didn't say which level of Gotenks would defeat Fat Boo. Not to mention that Goku also stated that he can't beat Fat Boo but later, right before the fight he had with Kid Boo, said that he could have but wanted to let the younger generation try and do it. Not to mention that there's also this point : Why didn't Goku panic when sensing Super Boo's power, since as we obviously saw, that SSJ Gotenks is weaker than Super Boo ? This pretty much nullifies your point of saying Goku was counting on the power SSJ Gotenks displayed to save the world. And no, as far as I remember Old Kai said that Gohan would be the strongest "under the heavens" or something similar, which obviously didn't include Goku. Not to mention that there's no evidence that Old Kai knew what Goku was capable of. I already pointed out why Goku said what he said inside of Boo so there's no point in mentioning it again.So up until now you haven't really proven anything.

Michael_Myers

As I pointed out above, what nullifies the fact that Goku was counting on the power SSJ Gotenks displayed to save the world is the fact that he didn't panic when he sensed Super Boo's power when he should have since SSJ Gotenks (Pre Rosat) is a lot weaker than him.

Rayne-Mayne

Lets look at it like this
Goku+Vegeta see buff buu, they
literally crap their pants. These two fearless warriors are
completely scared and afraid of fighting this 'buff' buu.
Now, Buu keeps transforming, and look how the reactions change.
Vegeta+Goku
BOTH become confident. They no longer are shaking in their
boots. Vegeta even insults kid buu.
I know your going to try and say its all because of size, but that is the biggest load of crap ever.
You
are trying to tell me that the two smartest warriors in all of dbz are
going to UNDERESTIMATE a warrior because of his SIZE? Please, its
just illogical. Obviously his power HAD to go down, because if i
didnt they wouldnt have became so confident.
Also, goku
told piccolo right after majin buu that he could have been able to win,
he didnt wait til kid buu to admit he could have.
Your
argument is so weak, and your entire size in side buu is just you
twisting the words to how you want them to mean. AT said
Gohan+Gotenks>goku. Goku refuses to fight super buu, even when
things look TERRIBLY grave on earth. Goku could do NOTHING
against super buu, and he admits this

Darkprince410

1) He is not insinuating that they may need to use the Room of Spirit and Time to face Buu, he's saying that they may need it later on in their lives, as at this point, they are set to be the sole guardians of the Earth (everyone thinks that Gohan is dead, and Gokuu is planning to return to the afterlife as well, putting the safety of the Earth in their hands). What would be the point of them using the Room to learn the fusion dance, then 20 years down the road they need two days to train to beat some new enemy, but they wasted some of their time earlier? That's what Gokuu is suggesting.

2) Pikkoro is impressed by their level of power, but he's not sure of just what all Gotenkusu is capable of, since he hasn't seen him fight or anything. He's not doubting their level of power at all.

Michael_Myers, the line about Shin Buu being stronger than Gokuu and Bejiita is not in reference to their size, but simply in reference to his power compared to theirs. "Like this" is denoting the level of power they have (and Gokuu knows full well that if they escape, they'll regain their size) and his confidence about winning towards Shin Buu (after he forms a miniature of himself within his own body) can easily be attributed to as a bluff. Gokuu is no idiot when it comes to fighting, and though he knows he can't win, he's not going to show that to the enemy (his conceding to Seru doesn't count, as he had no intention of seeing that fight through to the end anyhow)

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Evil Vegeta

They did make Buu out to be nothing when he became small, but they were totally wrong about that. Kid Buu was more of a threat then Super Buu appeared to be, and that's why Shin pissed his self when he saw him. I agree, Kid Buu may not be as powerful as the Buu with absorptions. But, he isn't as weak as people make him out to be. I would put him ahead of Super Buu.

Also, after Goku fought Buu, he told Piccolo he didn't know if he could win against Buu because of how strong he was. Later, after Goku and Vegeta played the rock, paper, scissors game, he said he could've beat Fat Buu, but he wanted the boys or whatever to have their chance at doing it. So, he did it state it much later.

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BurningVegeta

whats vegeta got to loose his already dead, and goku's an idiot he never backs down a fight where he knows people are depending on him you should know this after watching over 300 hours of DBZ anime

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Darkprince410

If Bejiita "dies" again while already dead, he'll cease to exist completely, with absolutely no way to wish him back. Even Enma-Daiou would be unable to do anything to bring him back. So technically he still has a great deal to lose if he were to die again.

1) "Like this" was meant to insinuate their level of power in compared to Shin Buu, and not about their size. Why would he show a great deal of fear towards fighting Shin Buu when just in Bejiita's company, but show confidence in how he'd fight him whenever Shin Buu forms a miniature of himself within his own body, unless it was indeed meant to be a bluff.

2) When Shin Buu started reverting to Chibi Buu, even though Mr. Buu was no longer attached to him, he still had his latent ki within him (and thus the latent ki of the Kaioushin-samas he absorbed). As the ki started to be "burned off" so to speak, Buu's body transformed accordingly. Since the Dai Kaioushin-sama was the later of the two absorbed, the effects of his ki on Buu deteriorated first, causing Buu to transform into the form he took after absorbing the South Kaioushin-sama (the extremely large, bulky form that some refer to as "Buff" Buu). It was the combination of his ki with Chibi Buu's ki that caused the power spike that Gokuu and Bejiita sensed (it's theorized that South Kaioushin-sama was actually a good deal stronger than Ssj3 Gokuu, explaining why Chibi Buu ended up absorbing him), as the good ki of the Dai Kaioushin-sama that was acting as a damper was no longer present. Eventually though, South Kaioushin-sama's ki dissipated as well, resulting in a massive power decrease when Chibi Buu forms.

3) Gokuu had no intention of the boys using the Room of Spirit and Time to defeat Fat Buu, as he was confident that they'd be strong enough as they were to beat him. As such, Ssj Gotenkusu (Pre-Room of Spirit and Time) is stronger than Fat Buu was according to Gokuu. Also, two direct statements (one to Buu and one to Pikkoro) about Gotenkusu being stronger than he is definately counts as more than none. Rou Dai Kaioushin-sama wouldn't have disregarded Gokuu as a candidate for the power up (since he could just give his life up to resurrect him if it came to that), but he opted for Gohan instead, and said that he'd make him the strongest fighter in the universe, and considering that because he is capable of sensing the hidden potential of people (otherwise how would he have known about Gohan's hidden strength?), he would have easily been able to sense what power Gokuu was capable of.

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Majuub

Goku wasn't refering to SSJ3 Gotenks since he had no idea the fusion could reach that, he wasn't refering to SSJ2 either since he said they might need the room of spirit and time, it means if Gotenks wasn't strong enough he would train to get stronger, only as SSJ, he didn't even know Gotenks could reach SSJ2, he thought he was strong enough in his SSJ state to take out Fat Buu. Goku was even impressed when Gotenks reached SSJ3 because he didn't expect him to go that high. He didn't panic when he sensed Shin Buu because he was focusing his attention on Gohan. I have the version in french and the elder Kai said in the universe, he was including Goku who didn't contradict him. Even if you put Goku at SSJ2 Gotenks level he would still be much weaker than Shin Buu. Goku didn't know that Gotenks could reach SSJ2 or SSJ3, that logic alone tears appart your whole post.

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