Madness

No, we can't deny the possibility EVER.

But you cannot prove it. Which you're required to do. The burden of proof was one you. You failed to provide any clincing proof.

You lost ANB. Get over it.

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ANB

I win :D

My theory was nothing more than opening up the possibility kthnxbai.

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Chibi Mystic Gohan

Who cares if it's possible or not? Maybe it is in the Dragon Ball universe? The point is, you created this topic with the affirmative statement "Gotenks was FASTER than the speed of light." We are simply proving that wrong.

I agree, anything is possible in Dragon Ball. It's a manga. But that doesn't mean everything that could happen, would happen. Goku's head could detach and fly around eating babies, all at Toriyama's whim. But would it happen?

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"Words don't exist so that we can tell the truth; they exist so that we can conceal the truth"
- ZOMBIEPOWDER. Volume 02

Madness

I win :D

My theory was nothing more than opening up the possibility that it can't kthnxbai.

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Vagrant Lustoid 2

Sorry, no. Let's see what the thread's title is, huh? Gotenks was FASTER than the speed of light.

That's an affirmative statement. Not a hypothetical statement. And a hypothetical theory still needs more than theoretical on-paper maths to be worth squat. Since there's no physical evidence of there being this possibility, you can't raise it. It's called suspension of disbelief. Until you know otherwise (not other examples that you may possibly extrapolate in an unrelated way) you have to rely on what is already known within your own realm of experience (that being the real world).

You didn't open up the possiblity, you claimed it as truth. When actually your argument lacks all falsifiability and as such is an invalid argument anyway.

As I learned, an argument relies on two things: facts and the logic that binds them together. If either side if weak, the argument is invalid.

As I've proven, your facts are unfalsifiable, meaning your logic is faulty and your entire argument is invalid. There you go, I just destroyed your argument at a university level.

Sorata

As far as I know it has been scientiffically proven that a single electron accelerated to 0,99995 C weighs almost 1 KG !!!

That multiplies the electrons mass by 6 x 10^27 (If I remember it right). Average 60kg human body accelerated to lightspeed would create such powerful gravitional field that Earth would be dragged with no effort.

I could consider Goku with Shunkanido being faster than the speed of light though. He can travel instantly to King Kai's planet and from there to New Namek. Whole light years of distance in a flash. Instant Transmission is a Ki tehnique so Goku could eventually travel with the speed of Ki which exceeds C by a huge margin.

But looking from another angle Goku could just travel beyond known space directly from point A to B.

Vagrant Lustoid 2

But that's not actually travel. Travel is traversing between point A and Z, and passing through points B to Y in between. Shunkanido simply moves him from A to Z without passing through B-Y and as such isn't actual travel. The key here is in this statement: He can travel instantly. If you go spontaneously and instantly from one point to another it's not travel.Travel is the act of progressing through both time and space from one coordinate to another. If you only travel through one of them (in this case, just space) you haven't technically travelled and haven't disobeyed the physical laws of the universe.

Madness

That's not speed, that's teleportation. Teleportation is simply; I'm here... and now I'm there. No travelling in between.

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Sorata

Thats why I said I could consider this possiblility.

Depending of how you look at teleportation it can be simply sending your whole body changed into electrons (or energy) all the way from A to B or like you wrote jumping from A to B.

ANB

I don't mean to be a prick...

...but I already admitted that it's only a possibility several pages back. The math is irrefutable.

What theory...? o_O What you have said doesn't refute the possiblity. You just wanted to do that!

Dude, being brutally honest here...

You have a stick up your ass. I go to college too, on a scholarship, and have passed last semester with honors. Don't go around flaunting your credentials with your superiority complex.

As for the arguement,

Quote:

Falsifiability (or refutability or testability) is the logical possibility that an assertion can be shown false by an observation or a physical experiment.

My "facts" are thus: that Gotenks could have been moving 192,000 miles per second. If him going at the speed is a possibility then you can't deny it's existence. So how does it being "unfalsifiable" make the logic faulty and invalid...?

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Vagrant Lustoid 2

I mention the college credentials because I've studied logic and argument and debating. On paper, your argument can hold true, but because of what I've learnt, I know that you can't use that as an example in any logically valid and reason debate, and anything else is just pissing into the wind, so I felt I should mention it, or else you might have said "lol but what does falsifiability have to do with my argument not working?".

Uh... the fact that it is impossible to prove whether he did or didn't through any way shape or form. My examples are falsifiable because they have a physical limit, beyond which that statement is untrue. Yours is not falsifiable because technically, even if he can go at beyond light speed, he doesn't have to, and thus any example I present where he doesn't (as I've been doing continuously) can be refuted through saying he doesn't have to travel at his max speed if he doesn't want to.

Thus it lacks falsifiability.

it's like God. God can't be proven to be existant or non-existant, and is thus an invalid argument. I have every reason to believe in him, but I wouldn't ever bring him up in a debate, since he's unfalsifiable. Gotenk's beyond-lightspeed travel is exactly the same.

Chibi Mystic Gohan

I don't trust your math, because you've already proven it to be unreliable. You claimed that light could circle the Earth once every second, which makes light seem eight times slower than it actually is. How do I know the rest of your math isn't faulty?

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"Words don't exist so that we can tell the truth; they exist so that we can conceal the truth"
- ZOMBIEPOWDER. Volume 02

Madness

Could have is not a fact sorry. You'll need more than that.

I refuted the fact simply by opposing it. Nothing more needs to be said. I have good evidence up against your theory. You've been disproved again and again and your counterargument has been "you can't prove it's not true". That's so childish I can't even begin to fathom what depths you've sunk to. I used to think you were good at this. Now I see it was nothing but an invisible pink dragon.

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ANB

1-So it lacks falsifiablity. And according to the scientific method if something cannot be tested it cannot be applied. You can't test the possibility he achieved that speed; ergo, there is nothing left to argue about.

2-No, God is verifiable even through science (depends on which religion you belong too). And Gotenks beyond light speed wouldn't be the same, it's a possibility in a manga where saying "it's scientifically impossible" as your only arguement DOESN'T WORK.


Madness, how many times do I have to tell you I DON'T think it's the only possibility...? Are you truly mad??? Or do you have selective hearing?


I said I was wrong about the math, let it go or it's officially trolling. Besides, any idiot can punch in the numbers and see that it's possible. Thus, that aspect of my math is irrefutable. I thought it was 23 times in 23 second because, evidently, you punch in 186,000 and divide by 8,000 to get 23. Thus, it goes into the Earth 23 times. I just assumed that was how to calculate it.

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Chibi Mystic Gohan