SRP76

Not that scouter, the scouter that blew off Frieza's head.

Deep thought

So, everyone's saying that the first time and only the first time when someone transforms into Super Sayajin is when they get fully healed?

That's like saying that the first time a Sayajin transformed into an Onzaru, he became 2X bigger than an other.

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Evil Vegeta

That's all we can use, though. We've never seen any of the other transformations under the same circumstances as Goku. We see Gohan, but he isn't damaged; Vegeta's is unknown, Future Trunks is unknown, and so forth.

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"ANB's Subordinate"

Deep thought

We can assume that Super Sayajin doesn't heal you fully. That's always an option.

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SRP76

No, it isn't. Unless you think being flooded with ki that you never had before is the same as growing bigger and howling at a moon.

GikuHonishimo

You can't. Goku was completely revitalized as a result of the transformation, and his strength increased as well. I wouldn't be surprised if it even healed the wounds he received prior to transforming. That's not to say it healed the wounds he received afterward though.

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- My official DBZ fanfiction.

SRP76

Something that the "it can't give them all a zenkai the first time" people are missing:

Nothing says that all of the Super Saiyans needed to be healed the first time they transformed. You can't heal a guy that isn't hurt. If, say, Vegeta wasn't hurt at all, just angry, when he transformed, he wouldn't get a powerup.

The only one we actually see as being injured the first time is Goku. The only other one we see transform the first time is Gohan, and he didn't need any kind of healing.

So the only one it may have even had the chance to affect is Goku.

uki1234

Agreed.

As I said before, Goku's first SSJ transformation is different from all others since its supposed to be the only one cos Akira wanted to end Dragonball with end of Frieza.

SSJ Transformation is supposed to be unique legendary transformation, so its very much possible that it heals as well as it multiplies power.

Its very much possible that when his wife and fans persuaded him to continue writing, he stopped using healing factor, since SSJ's would be almost unstoppable, and he couldn't fit it to the plot.

GikuHonishimo

Or it is also possible that he didn't need to use this factor since the majority of them wouldn't be injured upon transforming. If you'll notice, Gohan was also injured during his fight with Cell, but upon transforming into SSJ2, it seemed to revitalize him as well. Now I know he wasn't to the point like Goku, but he still took some good hits either way.

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- My official DBZ fanfiction.

Deep thought

Well, this theory is becoming a little bit more believable, but there's still one thing that bothers me.

Goku just didn't seem injured enough to get a zenkai. Let's look at everyone else.

Vegeta (Sayajin Saga): Hardly needs an explanation.

Goku (Sayajin Saga): Like Vegeta, hardly needs an explanation.

Vegeta (Namek Saga): Vegeta's face looked like lunch, and overall, he didn't look much better than his Sayajin Saga self.

Vegeta (Ginyu Saga): This one causes a lot of controversy, yet he was more injured than his Sayajin Saga self (BEFORE HE GOT CRUSHED BY GOHAN), and that Vegeta said that he needed medical attention, meaning that he was really badly injured. Keep in mind that that Vegeta could still punch Krillen and Gohan around.

Goku (Ginyu Saga): Not too much better than his Sayajin Saga self.

Goku (Freeza Saga): Needed someone for support and his eyes looked like a drunkard's.

Reference pictures in case you don't believe me: Android 17 vs Gohan

You see what I'm getting at?

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uki1234

I've pretty much no more to say than SRP said afterwords:

"I love how you conveniently only show Goku AFTER he's dragged out of the water by Piccolo, and has all the time in the world to recover (and still needs Krillin's help even in your scan), and yet, go out of your way to show Vegeta on his knees and try to claim he's "near death". Especially since you also show him standing usupported (which you stick in later, to try to make it look like it happened in that order), yet try to claim that he isn't.

So much for your so-called manga help.

And I can't help but notice that you go out of your way to avoid addressing Goku's clear showing of increased power when he went back to base against Frieza. That's twice that you've ducked it.

So here, answer the question:

WHY IS GOKU STRONGER AT THE END OF THE FRIEZA FIGHT THAN HE WAS AT THE BEGINNING?"

Ok now here are some other manga scans which prove Goku's injuries:

I think after this there is no need for further discussion since Goku was shown to be very much injured.



About being stronger after transformation itself:

How can he evade energy attack from someone so stronger than himself as100% worn out Frieza was stronger than base Goku before transformation:

Madness

Okay, first post here.

No.

It's not possible.

A) there was no healing administered, so no Zenkai.

B) Kaioken would be more useful than Super Saiyan. That in itself should have shown you your folly.

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uki1234

lol If you haven't noticed Goku went from barely standing to fully able to fight in an instant. I thought the word for that is "healing" in English language. You live in UK, so you should know that.

Goku forgot about kaioken at the same time when he forgot about tail and zenkai.

Madness

Oh so him dodging Freeza's attack isn't a plothole, but him forgetting about those is? Yeah right.

The Freeza thing is a plothole. The SSJ thing is a plothole. AT needed a dramatic opening for the Super Saiyan. That was it.

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uki1234

I didn't literally mean forgot. Just Akira decided to put kaioken, tails... behind.

Plothole is just a stupid excuse for something you can't explain or don't want to accept.