Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? - Page 2

Fred · 11-03-2007

I thought it was along these lines:
1.) Enduring loads of mental and physical pain.
2.) Powerful motivational emotion, whether it's anger(Goku), jealousy(Vegeta), or sheer force of will(Gohan, Trunks, Goten, Chibi Trunks).
3.) And the last requirement being Goal, to kill someone you absolutely hate(Goku-Frieza), to surpass someone who you rival with passion(Vegeta-Goku), or to meet the expectations of someone you love(Gohan-Goku, Trunks-Mirai Gohan).

Broly · 11-03-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devilz

Quote:

Originally Posted by King omega

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devilz

Like we know if Trunks was as conceived before or after Vegeta attained SSJ.

Umm both Trunks were born after Vegeta became SSJ

Prove it.

(All replies like this do is breed enmity, flamewars, and discontent. Refrain from doing that. --LegendarySSj7)

I said it was a theory. From the manga's point of view, it does not show what point in time Vegeta ascended during the 3-year training period. BUT, since both Goten and Trunks achieved SSj so easily and so early in their life, I'm of the belief that Vegeta was a Super Saiyan before he had intercourse with Bulma.

**LegendarySSJ7** · 11-03-2007

To me, the requisites are not so much sheer ire but a switch (and the proper range of power): in Goku's case it didn't require too much focus or accentuation, just the right incentive and switch. It recurs each millenium, so any Saiyan, hybrid or not, can obviously do it. The more anger and further delving into the transformation, the more intense it becomes (such as in SS2's case: to me, all of the forms are more an opening to what the legend is capable of as the voracious bolts of lightning that eventually dance over the fierce aura goes to show, as well as the amount of damage and tremendous impact Gohan sustained by a single nonchalant blast that was given off by SS2 Cell: it wasn't that Cell was at half power, because if that was the case then Freeza wouldn't have had such trouble against SS Goku with his fingerbeams).

In Vegeta's case, it was less not hitting the barrier due to power requirements but moreso discovering his switch (though the "training from hell" dialogue is rather open to interpretation, which causes it to be that much more mysterious the notion). And that a pure heart, evil or good, is also a prerequisite. As for Vegeta mastering the state by the Boo Saga Arc, yes: I've reiterated many times that over a 7-year period, there's no reason to believe he didn't, nor that he didn't achieve SS2. The telltale signs are his comments that Goku has surpassed the Super Saiyan wall "as well", and that still retaining the form after losing his "latent power-up", to me, insinuates the such.

ANB · 11-03-2007

^Oh ye~s, I forgot about the pure-heart thing. But (God-willing) my explanations of the "Ultra" forms are still valid.

deckzone3000 · 11-03-2007

That whole having to be pure hearted to become SSJ was something Krillin said. How would he know?
And it's hard for me to imagine Trunks and Vegeta being pure hearted either way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonkingpiccolo

Quote:

Originally Posted by deckzone3000

How did base Trunks knocked Cell out of the city with just his ki then?

Cell wasn't as powerful in the future as he was in the present time line, a good majority of the humans in the future were killed by 17 and 18 before Cell had a chance to get to them. And there's no way to tell how strong Cell was prior to him absorbing any humans, or absorbing the little that he could.

After absorbing people, he was stronger than the future androids were.

Cell > future 17 > future 18 > ssj Trunks(trunks saga) >> base Trunks(trunks saga)

Seems base Trunks got stronger to do what he did to Cell.

Evil Vegeta · 11-03-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by deckzone3000

After absorbing people, he was stronger than the future androids were.

I don't know about Cell being stronger then the Future Androids. There weren't as many people to absorb like there was in the regular timeline. He said something along the lines to make you think he was stronger: The spy robots show that you are no match for 17 and 18, much less myself. However, how does he know how powerful the androids are? That was just him assuming in my opinion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by deckzone3000

Seems base Trunks got stronger to do what he did to Cell.

Base Trunks was defintely more powerful when he came back. But, you have to remember this; Cell was most likely supressing his chi in order to sneak up on Trunks. Trunks still felt his presence, but Cell probably thought he could sneak up on him with his chi supressed. Cell also wasn't at his max, neither was Trunks. If Trunks fought full-power Cell in his base form, I think Cell would've won. The reason why, is because I don't think their increases are so great to the point where they can handle some of the more powerful enemies with just their base. If that was the case, Trunks would've crushed 17 and 18 without turning Super Saiyan, which I also don't think he could've done.

ANB · 11-04-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by deckzone3000

That whole having to be pure hearted to become SSJ was something Krillin said. How would he know?
And it's hard for me to imagine Trunks and Vegeta being pure hearted either way.

Oh please <=<

He also seemed to...

-Know 18 wasn't all bad

-Know Trunks was hiding his chi from Vegeta

-Know Cell really was warming up and had incredible reserves

+200 points for being Goku's best friend.

---

I'd like to see what you'll say about other infamous quotes, such as "Piccolo is like...the super namek...!!".

m.collins · 11-05-2007

The requirement are Powerlevel must be 100,000 or over ust be Pure of Heart(Good Or Evil) and needs to be very very mad

BurningVegeta · 11-05-2007

wasn't brolly a super saiyan when he was a child with a power level higher than that of 10,000

king omega · 11-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by burningvegeta

wasn't brolly a super saiyan when he was a child with a power level higher than that of 10,000

Yup, but i think the number is more like 100,000-500,000 since that would mean Vegeta would of been a SSJ in the Namek Saga.

Brolly probobly acheived SSJ around the age of 7 or so, like Goten and at that point they were probobly about even.

BurningVegeta · 11-05-2007

oh no i see i though the anime made no sense

Broly · 11-05-2007

There's no telling what age he became a SSj. We only know for sure that he ascended very early in his life.

Fred · 11-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by King omega

Quote:

Originally Posted by burningvegeta

wasn't brolly a super saiyan when he was a child with a power level higher than that of 10,000

Yup, but i think the number is more like 100,000-500,000 since that would mean Vegeta would of been a SSJ in the Namek Saga.

Brolly probobly acheived SSJ around the age of 7 or so, like Goten and at that point they were probobly about even.

No, the number was 10,000. Stated. And he doesn't go SSJ until after he almost dies.

**LegendarySSJ7** · 11-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonny America

No, the number was 10,000. Stated. And he doesn't go SSJ until after he almost dies.

Stated? Indeed? If by "stated" you mean "what is said in non-canon movies, let alone the Broli movies", then, yes, if that's in question, to be punctilious... you're quite right. But it certainly is not the stated number in the canon Manga.... there is no stated number. Had that been the number, Vegeta would have had a chance at breaking the Super Saiyan barrier long before his rampage on Earth with Nappa. Perhaps this (<-- click... it's pinned on the top of this forum, FYI) would be a good read on the matter that would clear up the befuddlement, and detail out the difference between "canon" and "non-canon" with merit.
EDIT - For the sake of lucidity, "the stated number in the Canon Manga" referenced the requisite itself in terms of battle power where one could break the Super Saiyan barrier, it was more of a general statement that was meant to overthrow any notion of Broli being correlated with the Manga, as non-canon as he is.

SRP76 · 11-06-2007

The fact that rage triggers the Super Saiyan transformation is stated.

By at least 4 different characters, on 5 different occasions. Seems like Toriyama means for rage to trigger the transformation, doesn't it?

I love the "it doesn't show Trunks and Goten!" argument. It also didn't show their parents banging, but the kids were born, weren't they?

11-03-2007	#16 (permalink)
Fred (25) Kami of Earth Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: New York Posts: 4,060 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 84	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? I thought it was along these lines: 1.) Enduring loads of mental and physical pain. 2.) Powerful motivational emotion, whether it's anger(Goku), jealousy(Vegeta), or sheer force of will(Gohan, Trunks, Goten, Chibi Trunks). 3.) And the last requirement being Goal, to kill someone you absolutely hate(Goku-Frieza), to surpass someone who you rival with passion(Vegeta-Goku), or to meet the expectations of someone you love(Gohan-Goku, Trunks-Mirai Gohan). __________________

11-03-2007	#18 (permalink)
LegendarySSJ7 Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: LA, CA, USA. Posts: 2,736 Rep Power: 48	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? To me, the requisites are not so much sheer ire but a switch (and the proper range of power): in Goku's case it didn't require too much focus or accentuation, just the right incentive and switch. It recurs each millenium, so any Saiyan, hybrid or not, can obviously do it. The more anger and further delving into the transformation, the more intense it becomes (such as in SS2's case: to me, all of the forms are more an opening to what the legend is capable of as the voracious bolts of lightning that eventually dance over the fierce aura goes to show, as well as the amount of damage and tremendous impact Gohan sustained by a single nonchalant blast that was given off by SS2 Cell: it wasn't that Cell was at half power, because if that was the case then Freeza wouldn't have had such trouble against SS Goku with his fingerbeams). In Vegeta's case, it was less not hitting the barrier due to power requirements but moreso discovering his switch (though the "training from hell" dialogue is rather open to interpretation, which causes it to be that much more mysterious the notion). And that a pure heart, evil or good, is also a prerequisite. As for Vegeta mastering the state by the Boo Saga Arc, yes: I've reiterated many times that over a 7-year period, there's no reason to believe he didn't, nor that he didn't achieve SS2. The telltale signs are his comments that Goku has surpassed the Super Saiyan wall "as well", and that still retaining the form after losing his "latent power-up", to me, insinuates the such. __________________

11-03-2007	#19 (permalink)
ANB (24) Super Saiyan 4 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,994 Rep Power: 46	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? ^Oh ye~s, I forgot about the pure-heart thing. But (God-willing) my explanations of the "Ultra" forms are still valid. __________________

11-05-2007	#23 (permalink)
m.collins (17) Super Saiyan Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 712 Blog Entries: 4 Rep Power: 13	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? The requirement are Powerlevel must be 100,000 or over ust be Pure of Heart(Good Or Evil) and needs to be very very mad __________________

11-05-2007	#27 (permalink)
Broly The Desolate One Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: You think I give a shit about where you think I stay? Posts: 7,543 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 33	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? There's no telling what age he became a SSj. We only know for sure that he ascended very early in his life. __________________ $C:\Users\Silver Platter\Pictures\Broly_SSJ5_by_Gothax.jpg$

11-06-2007	#30 (permalink)
SRP76 (23) Final Warrior Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,341 Blog Entries: 1 Rep Power: 39	Re: Requirements for Super Saiyan transformation? The fact that rage triggers the Super Saiyan transformation is stated. By at least 4 different characters, on 5 different occasions. Seems like Toriyama means for rage to trigger the transformation, doesn't it? I love the "it doesn't show Trunks and Goten!" argument. It also didn't show their parents banging, but the kids were born, weren't they?