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| DragonBall / Z Discuss and debate the canon events of the anime and manga by Akira Toriyama. |
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#61 (permalink) |
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(19) Mastered Super Saiyan
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When Rai Kaioshin said they'd probably not need to be SSj before the transformation, he was talking about a fusion between Goku and Gohan. Then you throw in a weaker than Gohan, Vegeta... The question becomes: "Would the power being lost by a fusion of Goku and Vegeta insted of Goku and Gohan be enough that he would need to transform to beat Boo, or was in really only minor?"
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#62 (permalink) |
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Moderator
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Plus, Dai Kaioshin had in mind they would be fighting Shin Buu (Gotenks absorbed), not Gohan, which makes quite the difference. But, according to the anime, even without the transformation, base Vegeto was far above Shin Buu (Gohan prime). Everyone can pick what they want here, I guess... By the way, happy new year!
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#63 (permalink) |
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(17) Super Saiyan
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[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
Trunks: 45,000 [Super Saiyajin]: 2,250,000 Son Gohan: 2,500,000 [Super Saiyajin]: 125,000,000 Trunks [3 years later]: 3,000,000 [Super Saiyajin, 3 years later]: 150,000,000 [/quote] I just noticed this. Is the part I bolded a typo?
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Gohan during the cell games is a KID! Gohan during the buu saga is a TEEN! |
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#64 (permalink) |
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Moderator
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[quote user="deckzone3000"][quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
Trunks: 45,000 [Super Saiyajin]: 2,250,000 Son Gohan: 2,500,000 [Super Saiyajin]: 125,000,000 Trunks [3 years later]: 3,000,000 [Super Saiyajin, 3 years later]: 150,000,000 [/quote] I just noticed this. Is the part I bolded a typo?[/quote]The part you bolded that's in question is no place near a typo and not something grody I'd peter out. Wasn't inactivity on my part, either, as I feel that Trunk's SSj multiplier at that point was 50x, no less (and that my eyes draw down to the conclusion that said multiplier ebbs with training [though not to the degree on which it would through complete mastery of the form, nothing hidden in that gaze], if that doesn't sound cudgeling). As a Super Saiyan, he was strong enough to even leave base Mirai Gohan relatively impressed at the height of their battle. Of course, this is the same Gohan that has been plugging at the form for year's duration as well, though I still feel his multiplier remained relatively unchanged (and as by Vegeta's own admission in Volume 29 / 13, page 86: "We Saiyans can't be reduced to numbers.").
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#65 (permalink) |
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(8) Saiyan Warrior
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 95
Rep Power: 3
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hey legendary doesnt kid boo = evil boo?
and super boo = evil boo + fat boo ? because he did absorb him
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"Whoever wins, out battle does not end. The loser is freed from the battlefield, the winner must remain there and the survivor must live his life as the warrior until he dies” |
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#66 (permalink) |
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Super Moderator
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Chibi Buu and Aku Buu can be shown to have a similar range of power, but that is the extent of it. They are similar beings, containing the same ki essentially, but different at base. The only reason Fat Buu was actually placed at lower than Chibi Buu as well, was due to two things; a) his power normally being surpressed by the good in his nature; and b) he was never shown at full effort.
No. The Fat Buu had been severely weakened, drained of the internal anger that drew out his power and losing the evil ki contained within him...which was a large chunk of it. Simply adding it together again would result in the exact same power as Fat Buu. Shin Buu was...multiple times stronger than Fat Buu, evidently. In this new form of Buu, the evil was dominant. Essentially, he lost all restraints and composed mostly of the evil ki of rage, his power thrived in comparison.
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#67 (permalink) |
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(17) Super Saiyan
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[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
[Gohan prime] - 6,400,000,000,000 Vegetto - 7,800,000,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 39,000,000,000,000 [/quote] If Vegetto was stronger than Buu why did he transform into a SS?
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Gohan during the cell games is a KID! Gohan during the buu saga is a TEEN! |
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#68 (permalink) |
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Moderator
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Of course, that question is adressed to LegendarySSj7, but I will take the liberty to try to reply to this one.
Vegeto didn't want to kill Shin Buu-initially. His first priority was to enter his body and release the people he had absorbed. To do this, he had to ensure two things. First, that Buu would be desparate enough to absorb him as well, and second, that he would actually be able to block the absorption with his technique, allowing himself to retain control of his body while inside Buu. By LegendarySSj7's numbers, Vegeto could have easily outclassed Shin Buu in his base, but not by the "I OWN YOU FOR FUN" amount. Secondly, there was the ki problem-Vegeto might have doubted his ability to form an effective Ki barrier against Shin Buu's absorption while at base form. So he transformed into a Super Saiya-jinn. As for whether Vegeto was actually stronger than Shin Buu... base <INSERT name for fusion between Gohan and Goku> was stated to be stronger than Shin Buu (Gotenks prime), enough to beat him with quite an ease, so as not to endanger himself, or the planet in the process, so I'd say, for Rou Dai Kaioshin to be so certain, a 1.3x difference seems the minimum. Shin Buu (Gohan prime) was approximately 1,25x Shin Buu (Gotenks prime). All that remains is to determine the difference between the hypothetical fusion between Goku and Gohan and Vegeto. But for simpler reference, if we actually use the multiplier for SSj Goten/Trunks fusing into SSj Gotenks, and taking into account that Potara fusion >> Fusion dance technique, I think we can deduct that base Vegeto > Shin Buu (Gohan prime). With my numbers, that's what I get anyway.
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#69 (permalink) |
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(17) Super Saiyan
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[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
Volume 20 Son Gohan [relaxed or "Great Saiyaman"] - 1,600,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin, minimal effort] - 8,000,000,000 Son Goten - 1,320,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,600,000,000 Vegeta - 4,600,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 23,000,000,000 Chibi Trunks - 1,400,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 7,000,000,000 Son Goku - 5,400,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 27,000,000,000 Volume 21 Son Goten - 1,250,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,250,000,000 Chibi Trunks - 1,300,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,500,000,000 ![]() Spopovitch - 4,250 Videl - 45 Yamu - 4,250 Son Gohan - 2,500,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 12,500,000,000 [Super Saiyajin 2] - 150,000,000,000 Volume 22 Vegeta - 5,700,000,000 Pui Pui - 26,000 Yakon - 8,500,000,000 Son Goku - 6,400,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 32,000,000,000 #18 - 520,000,000 "Mighty Mask" - 440,000,000 [Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 2,200,000,000 Super Saiyajin Son Gohan - 12,500,000,000 Dabra - 13,475,000,000 Mastered Super Saiyajin Vegeta - 28,500,000,000 [Possessed] - 32,000,000,000 [Possessed, Super Saiyajin 2] - 225,000,000,000 Mastered Super Saiyajin Son Goku - 32,000,000,000 [Super Saiyajin 2] - 225,000,000,000 [/quote] You have Goku, Gohan, and Vegeta at lower power levels for volume 20 then 21 & 22. But the opposite for Goten and Trunks. Did you get the numbers switched or were the boys holding back in their fight with each other?
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Gohan during the cell games is a KID! Gohan during the buu saga is a TEEN! |
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#70 (permalink) | |
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(1) Earthling
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2
Rep Power: 0
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Quote:
1: Gogeta is not weaker than SSJ3 Gotenks, his powerlevel should be higher. 2: SSJ3 Goku was never stronger, or anywhere near base Vegerot (Vegetto), nor was he ever anywhere near SSJ3 Gotenks. |
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#71 (permalink) | ||
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(28) Lord of Worlds
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Damn, haven't seen this topic in a minute.
I agree with you, though. Gotenks is nowhere near Gogeta, and SSJ3 Goku is weaker then SSJ Gotenks.
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#72 (permalink) |
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(20) Super Saiyan 2
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: NJ
Posts: 1,309
Rep Power: 10
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Why was this topic revived when those questions could just have been asked in a new thread?
-It's LegendarySSJ7's personal opinion that ssj Gogeta (both a theoretical canon and the non-canon one) are much weaker than Super Boo, let alone ssj3 Gotenks. -If you're talking about ssj3 Goku in Movie 13, it's because in the movie he was potrayed as being much stronger than Ultimate Gohan and ssj3 Gotenks, even though that's obviously not true. Not to mini-mod, but don't revive old topics like this in the future.
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