Tyro

When Rai Kaioshin said they'd probably not need to be SSj before the transformation, he was talking about a fusion between Goku and Gohan. Then you throw in a weaker than Gohan, Vegeta... The question becomes: "Would the power being lost by a fusion of Goku and Vegeta insted of Goku and Gohan be enough that he would need to transform to beat Boo, or was in really only minor?"

JAIF

Plus, Dai Kaioshin had in mind they would be fighting Shin Buu (Gotenks absorbed), not Gohan, which makes quite the difference. But, according to the anime, even without the transformation, base Vegeto was far above Shin Buu (Gohan prime). Everyone can pick what they want here, I guess... By the way, happy new year!

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deckzone3000

[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
Trunks: 45,000
[Super Saiyajin]: 2,250,000
Son Gohan: 2,500,000
[Super Saiyajin]: 125,000,000
Trunks [3 years later]: 3,000,000
[Super Saiyajin, 3 years later]: 150,000,000
[/quote] I just noticed this. Is the part I bolded a typo?

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Gohan during the cell games is a KID!
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LegendarySSJ7

[quote user="deckzone3000"][quote user="LegendarySSj7"]

Trunks: 45,000

[Super Saiyajin]: 2,250,000

Son Gohan: 2,500,000

[Super Saiyajin]: 125,000,000

Trunks [3 years later]: 3,000,000

[Super Saiyajin, 3 years later]: 150,000,000

[/quote] I just noticed this. Is the part I bolded a typo?[/quote]The part you bolded that's in question is no place near a typo and not something grody I'd peter out. Wasn't inactivity on my part, either, as I feel that Trunk's SSj multiplier at that point was 50x, no less (and that my eyes draw down to the conclusion that said multiplier ebbs with training [though not to the degree on which it would through complete mastery of the form, nothing hidden in that gaze], if that doesn't sound cudgeling). As a Super Saiyan, he was strong enough to even leave base Mirai Gohan relatively impressed at the height of their battle. Of course, this is the same Gohan that has been plugging at the form for year's duration as well, though I still feel his multiplier remained relatively unchanged (and as by Vegeta's own admission in Volume 29 / 13, page 86: "We Saiyans can't be reduced to numbers.").

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Vito

hey legendary doesnt kid boo = evil boo?
and super boo = evil boo + fat boo ? because he did absorb him

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SS2 Vegeto

Chibi Buu and Aku Buu can be shown to have a similar range of power, but that is the extent of it. They are similar beings, containing the same ki essentially, but different at base. The only reason Fat Buu was actually placed at lower than Chibi Buu as well, was due to two things; a) his power normally being surpressed by the good in his nature; and b) he was never shown at full effort.

No. The Fat Buu had been severely weakened, drained of the internal anger that drew out his power and losing the evil ki contained within him...which was a large chunk of it. Simply adding it together again would result in the exact same power as Fat Buu. Shin Buu was...multiple times stronger than Fat Buu, evidently. In this new form of Buu, the evil was dominant. Essentially, he lost all restraints and composed mostly of the evil ki of rage, his power thrived in comparison.

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deckzone3000

[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
[Gohan prime] - 6,400,000,000,000

Vegetto - 7,800,000,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 39,000,000,000,000
[/quote] If Vegetto was stronger than Buu why did he transform into a SS?

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Gohan during the cell games is a KID!
Gohan during the buu saga is a TEEN!

JAIF

Of course, that question is adressed to LegendarySSj7, but I will take the liberty to try to reply to this one.
Vegeto didn't want to kill Shin Buu-initially. His first priority was to enter his body and release the people he had absorbed. To do this, he had to ensure two things. First, that Buu would be desparate enough to absorb him as well, and second, that he would actually be able to block the absorption with his technique, allowing himself to retain control of his body while inside Buu.
By LegendarySSj7's numbers, Vegeto could have easily outclassed Shin Buu in his base, but not by the "I OWN YOU FOR FUN" amount. Secondly, there was the ki problem-Vegeto might have doubted his ability to form an effective Ki barrier against Shin Buu's absorption while at base form. So he transformed into a Super Saiya-jinn.
As for whether Vegeto was actually stronger than Shin Buu... base <INSERT name for fusion between Gohan and Goku> was stated to be stronger than Shin Buu (Gotenks prime), enough to beat him with quite an ease, so as not to endanger himself, or the planet in the process, so I'd say, for Rou Dai Kaioshin to be so certain, a 1.3x difference seems the minimum. Shin Buu (Gohan prime) was approximately 1,25x Shin Buu (Gotenks prime). All that remains is to determine the difference between the hypothetical fusion between Goku and Gohan and Vegeto.
But for simpler reference, if we actually use the multiplier for SSj Goten/Trunks fusing into SSj Gotenks, and taking into account that Potara fusion >> Fusion dance technique, I think we can deduct that base Vegeto > Shin Buu (Gohan prime). With my numbers, that's what I get anyway.

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deckzone3000

[quote user="LegendarySSj7"]
Volume 20
Son Gohan [relaxed or "Great Saiyaman"] - 1,600,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin, minimal effort] - 8,000,000,000
Son Goten - 1,320,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,600,000,000
Vegeta - 4,600,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 23,000,000,000
Chibi Trunks - 1,400,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 7,000,000,000
Son Goku - 5,400,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 27,000,000,000

Volume 21

Son Goten - 1,250,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,250,000,000
Chibi Trunks - 1,300,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 6,500,000,000


Spopovitch - 4,250
Videl - 45
Yamu - 4,250

Son Gohan - 2,500,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 12,500,000,000
[Super Saiyajin 2] - 150,000,000,000

Volume 22
Vegeta - 5,700,000,000
Pui Pui - 26,000

Yakon - 8,500,000,000
Son Goku - 6,400,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 32,000,000,000

#18 - 520,000,000
"Mighty Mask" - 440,000,000
[Mastered Super Saiyajin] - 2,200,000,000

Super Saiyajin Son Gohan - 12,500,000,000
Dabra - 13,475,000,000

Mastered Super Saiyajin Vegeta - 28,500,000,000
[Possessed] - 32,000,000,000
[Possessed, Super Saiyajin 2] - 225,000,000,000
Mastered Super Saiyajin Son Goku - 32,000,000,000
[Super Saiyajin 2] - 225,000,000,000


[/quote] You have Goku, Gohan, and Vegeta at lower power levels for volume 20 then 21 & 22. But the opposite for Goten and Trunks. Did you get the numbers switched or were the boys holding back in their fight with each other?

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Combat_Guru

As great as this list is, it still has a couple of errors, I've discussed these on many occasions, many people consider this to be completely accurate, but I beg to differ.

1: Gogeta is not weaker than SSJ3 Gotenks, his powerlevel should be higher.

2: SSJ3 Goku was never stronger, or anywhere near base Vegerot (Vegetto), nor was he ever anywhere near SSJ3 Gotenks.

Evil Vegeta

Damn, haven't seen this topic in a minute.

I agree with you, though. Gotenks is nowhere near Gogeta, and SSJ3 Goku is weaker then SSJ Gotenks.

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