SaiyajinPerfection

[quote user="Buutenks"][quote user="demonkingpiccolo"] In order to create an after image to an opponent that is in close proximity, you need to move at a pace that is close to light speed. Your image must take the time to reach your opponent's eyes (who was in close proximity every time), so virtually, no time is lost. But in order to just disappear (like they do while travling SHORT distances [like I said before] you don't need to travel at the speed of light, just at a speed where the opponent can't follow.) During Dragonball, The distance traveled from point A to point B inside Muscle Tower was very short (only a few meters or so) so it is a possibility that Goku could have been moving at the speed of light for a split second. (Remember, Goku couldn't fly at this point, so his thrust was not constant.)
If Gotenks was truly as fast as the speed of light, he could've traveled around the Earth roughly 6 times per second. (The Earth is roughly 30,000 miles in circumfrence, light travels at 186,000 miles per second) 30/186 = 6.2. But it only shows 5 streaks in the panel, nowhere near the 111,600 times that he could've gone around in is half hour
(6.2 x60 =3,720) (Seconds x 60 = 1 minute) (and then that times 30 to make a half hour) (which equals 111,600) (A few Dozen times is NOT that, a few dozen is much lower). And I don't actually believe that Gotenks took a nap, he was a Super Saiyan when Piccolo found him, and the only Saiyans that were able to sustain Super Saiyan state while asleep were Goku and Gohan during the Cell saga. (And I don't even think that fact was canon).


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Gotenks stated in the manga that he took a nap and Piccolo didn't said that he was lying.If it took him 29 minutes to go 5 times arond the world then it means that he isn't faster than Goku from the saiyan saga or Goku from the Freeza saga.So he must've taken a nap and he stated that he took.But still if you do think that it took him 29 minutes than it means that he's the slowest character in dbz,well he's probably faster than Raditz.Goku in the Freeza saga went over islands in one second,now when he went ss he was 50 times faster,this means that he's faster than ssj Gotenks if it took Gotenks 29 minutes to go around the world. [/quote]
When did I ever say that it took him 29 minutes to go around the world? It took him 29 minutes for Piccolo to catch up with him (well more like 28 because right after Gotenks was fused he was talking to Piccolo), but even then Piccolo was much stronger then a Super Saiyan at that point, so going by your theory (if your theory's correct that is) (assuming that he was the same speed as SS Goku during the Freeza saga, maybe even faster since in the Buu saga Piccolo was much stronger) he could've caught up with Gotenks in about 1 second, not 29 minutes. Where did that other 27 and 1/2 minutes go (excluding the predicted time that he was talking to Piccolo when he was first fused)?

That is your theory. It is not fact. We never see Gotenks power down and then power up agian. And Piccolo may have never said that Gotenks didn't take a nap, but he never said he did either.

Like I've said for the past five times, the distance that Goku and Frieza traveled was short, they didn't fly around the world a couple dozen times like Gotenks did. And I didn't state that he wasn't in space, I DID state that.

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ultimate sayia-jin 5

[quote user="Vegeta-the most powerful sayajin"] [quote user="ultimate sayia-jin 5"]One thing people are forgetting is that even if Gotenks did fly around the world 24-36 times in a second it is still an inconsistancy. Roshi Kamehameha traveled the distance between earth and the moon in about a second this event happpened much before any other traveling event that has been mentioned. Roshi's kamehameha is comonly estimated at 350 so based of the 115 Billion power level I gave Pre RoSaT Gotenks this would allow him to travel 10.4 Light years a second meaning he could travel between earth and proxima centuari 2.4 Times in a second. Some people may say the Roshi thing was a plot device, however it still happened and should be taken seriously in my opinion.[/quote]

If that's the case Vegeta's galick gun, him being only yards high, would have reached the earth in an instant. But Goku managed to charge and launch a Kamehameha to counter it. Either Goku has some SERIOUS skill or ki blasts don't follow the "the stronger it is, the faster it is" rule. Roshi could have done the Kamehameha in a way that it traveled through space at ultra fast speeds because no other ki blast ever matched this speed(except probaby Freeza's Death Ray)

[/quote] For Goku to do what he did he if the blast travels at FTL speeds he would need a extremly fast reaction time and a faster speed of thought. This leads me to a theroy of mine. I'm sure most would agree that MSSJ Goku warming up and Cell warming up were faster then sound however Goku was able to say Ka Me Ha Me Ha before cell hit him. For this to work dragonball Z characters would have to be able to create there own speed of sound to move at there fighting or flight speeds and if they can create there own speed of sound they probaly can create their own speed of thought and reaction time to equal there current speed.

Buutenks

[quote user="demonkingpiccolo"][quote user="Buutenks"][quote user="demonkingpiccolo"] In order to create an after image to an opponent that is in close proximity, you need to move at a pace that is close to light speed. Your image must take the time to reach your opponent's eyes (who was in close proximity every time), so virtually, no time is lost. But in order to just disappear (like they do while travling SHORT distances [like I said before] you don't need to travel at the speed of light, just at a speed where the opponent can't follow.) During Dragonball, The distance traveled from point A to point B inside Muscle Tower was very short (only a few meters or so) so it is a possibility that Goku could have been moving at the speed of light for a split second. (Remember, Goku couldn't fly at this point, so his thrust was not constant.)
If Gotenks was truly as fast as the speed of light, he could've traveled around the Earth roughly 6 times per second. (The Earth is roughly 30,000 miles in circumfrence, light travels at 186,000 miles per second) 30/186 = 6.2. But it only shows 5 streaks in the panel, nowhere near the 111,600 times that he could've gone around in is half hour
(6.2 x60 =3,720) (Seconds x 60 = 1 minute) (and then that times 30 to make a half hour) (which equals 111,600) (A few Dozen times is NOT that, a few dozen is much lower). And I don't actually believe that Gotenks took a nap, he was a Super Saiyan when Piccolo found him, and the only Saiyans that were able to sustain Super Saiyan state while asleep were Goku and Gohan during the Cell saga. (And I don't even think that fact was canon).


[/quote]

Gotenks stated in the manga that he took a nap and Piccolo didn't said that he was lying.If it took him 29 minutes to go 5 times arond the world then it means that he isn't faster than Goku from the saiyan saga or Goku from the Freeza saga.So he must've taken a nap and he stated that he took.But still if you do think that it took him 29 minutes than it means that he's the slowest character in dbz,well he's probably faster than Raditz.Goku in the Freeza saga went over islands in one second,now when he went ss he was 50 times faster,this means that he's faster than ssj Gotenks if it took Gotenks 29 minutes to go around the world. [/quote]
When did I ever say that it took him 29 minutes to go around the world? It took him 29 minutes for Piccolo to catch up with him (well more like 28 because right after Gotenks was fused he was talking to Piccolo), but even then Piccolo was much stronger then a Super Saiyan at that point, so going by your theory (if your theory's correct that is) (assuming that he was the same speed as SS Goku during the Freeza saga, maybe even faster since in the Buu saga Piccolo was much stronger) he could've caught up with Gotenks in about 1 second, not 29 minutes. Where did that other 27 and 1/2 minutes go (excluding the predicted time that he was talking to Piccolo when he was first fused)?

That is your theory. It is not fact. We never see Gotenks power down and then power up agian. And Piccolo may have never said that Gotenks didn't take a nap, but he never said he did either.

Like I've said for the past five times, the distance that Goku and Frieza traveled was short, they didn't fly around the world a couple dozen times like Gotenks did. And I didn't state that he wasn't in space, I DID state that.
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What do you think Gotenks did in those 26-27 minutes?(26-27 because he's only half saiyan so he can't survive in space using his full speed for more than 2 minutes).Gotenks made his trip in 1 minute or less(because like I said he can't survive in space using his full speed more than a minute),so what do you think he did in the remaning 26-27 minutes?


Goku can go over islands in one second,it means that he can go with 10 km/s.So he can easily go around the world,one time in 29 minute,now kaio-ken 20 Golu can fly 20 times faster than that,so it means that he can go with 200 km/s.So it would take him 1-2 minutes to go around the world one time.

When Goku fights he is not talking,when he says Kamehameha he doesn't move,everybody can see him.And they were way faster than sound speed.Vegeta,Piccolo,Trunks and the others could barely keep track of them,so they were way faster than that.
Please avoid double-posting. -The Chibi Kiriyama

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

Buutenks

How fast do you need to fly to make this:

You know where Freeza flies so fast that rocks were being ripped.And there are more scenes like this one.So how fast would one need to fly to do that?



You see those rocks being ripped while Freeza went past them,how fast would you need to be for that to happen?
EDIT: The images will be allowed as will the post, but I again implore you about the rules... -The Chibi Kiriyama

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

ultimate sayia-jin 5

[quote user="Buutenks"][quote user="ultimate sayia-jin 5"][quote user="Vegeta-the most powerful sayajin"] [quote user="ultimate sayia-jin 5"]One thing people are forgetting is that even if Gotenks did fly around the world 24-36 times in a second it is still an inconsistancy. Roshi Kamehameha traveled the distance between earth and the moon in about a second this event happpened much before any other traveling event that has been mentioned. Roshi's kamehameha is comonly estimated at 350 so based of the 115 Billion power level I gave Pre RoSaT Gotenks this would allow him to travel 10.4 Light years a second meaning he could travel between earth and proxima centuari 2.4 Times in a second. Some people may say the Roshi thing was a plot device, however it still happened and should be taken seriously in my opinion.[/quote]

If that's the case Vegeta's galick gun, him being only yards high, would have reached the earth in an instant. But Goku managed to charge and launch a Kamehameha to counter it. Either Goku has some SERIOUS skill or ki blasts don't follow the "the stronger it is, the faster it is" rule. Roshi could have done the Kamehameha in a way that it traveled through space at ultra fast speeds because no other ki blast ever matched this speed(except probaby Freeza's Death Ray)

[/quote] For Goku to do what he did he if the blast travels at FTL speeds he would need a extremly fast reaction time and a faster speed of thought. This leads me to a theroy of mine. I'm sure most would agree that MSSJ Goku warming up and Cell warming up were faster then sound however Goku was able to say Ka Me Ha Me Ha before cell hit him. For this to work dragonball Z characters would have to be able to create there own speed of sound to move at there fighting or flight speeds and if they can create there own speed of sound they probaly can create their own speed of thought and reaction time to equal there current speed.
[/quote]
When Goku fights he is not talking,when he says Kamehameha he doesn't move,everybody can see him.And they were way faster than sound speed.Vegeta,Piccolo,Trunks and the others could barely keep track of them,so they were way faster than that.
[/quote] I Know there faster then sound that is what I am saying, my calculations put Goku warming up as being able to move 20% of a light year per second. What I am saying is that despite the fact that Goku was flying at Cell at faster then sound speedas he was able to finish saying Ka Me Ha Me Ha before he reached Cell. As weird as this sounds this leads me to belive they create their own speed of sound that increases with their powerlevel otherwise goku would have reached cell before he finished talking.

SaiyajinPerfection

[quote user="Buutenks"]
What do you think Gotenks did in those 26-27 minutes?(26-27 because he's only half saiyan so he can't survive in space using his full speed for more than 2 minutes).Gotenks made his trip in 1 minute or less(because like I said he can't survive in space using his full speed more than a minute),so what do you think he did in the remaning 26-27 minutes?


Goku can go over islands in one second,it means that he can go with 10 km/s.So he can easily go around the world,one time in 29 minute,now kaio-ken 20 Golu can fly 20 times faster than that,so it means that he can go with 200 km/s.So it would take him 1-2 minutes to go around the world one time.


[/quote] The distance that Goku traveled to escape Frieza's imprisonment ball explosion is not a confirmable distance, and is NEVER mentioned. It is also NEVER stated how long it took him to get from the Explosion area back to the area that Gohan, Krillin, Piccolo, and Frieza were at. Therefore you can't come up with that theory of 10 km/s, and be able to prove it.
I think the evidence of Gotenks's speed lies in the time it took Piccolo to catch up with him. Piccolo by the Buu saga had far surpassed Super Saiyan Goku in the Frieza saga, and judging by your theory on Goku's speed in the Frieza saga, and then comparing it to Piccolo's speed in the Buu Saga, even if it took Gotenks only a few seconds to go around the world a couple dozen times, Piccolo could've caught up with him in about 1 second when he stopped to take a nap.
In other words, going by your theory (Based on your Gotenks Theory, and your comparison of Goku and Piccolo theory), it would've taken Piccolo at most 5 seconds to catch up with Gotenks after he stopped. Why? Because remember the math I did, you can roughly fly around the Earth 6.2 times if you actually flew at the speed of light, giving piccolo plenty of time to catch up with Gotenks. But Gotenks states that he only circled the Earth a few dozen times, not the 111,600 times that he could have. But by the time Piccolo found him (Assuming that Piccolo could travel faster then Goku during the Frieza saga) It would've taken Piccolo about a second to catch up with Gotenks.
So your arguement is flawed:
*Gotenks states that he only circled the Earth several dozen times, not the 111,600 times that he could have in his half hour.
* Piccolo could've caught up with Gotenks in about a second if you go with your theory of him being faster then Goku during the Frieza saga (assuming that he is considering that Buu Saga Piccolo is far stronger then Frieza saga Super Saiyan Goku).
*If Gotenks truly was as fast as the speed of light, "a few dozen times" (official statement from Gotenks himself) would only consist of a few seconds. And considering that Piccolo could catch up with Gotenks in about a second (Based of the Theory of comparing him to Frieza saga Goku), roughly only 3-10 seconds would've passed from the time that Gotenks started flying to the time that Piccolo caught up with him. But Piccolo clearly states that he had less then a minute before Gotenks became Goten and Trunks again, so where did the 28 minutes go?
My theory: Gotenks bluffed when he said that he took a nap, in order to glorify himself and brag to Piccolo about his speed. One second is hardly enough time to settle down and even close your eyes. Part 2 of My theory: Gotenks is fast, but nowhere near light speed. The intervals of time from Gotenks' first take off, to Piccolo's catching up with him are WAY too close to fit as comfortably as they did in the half hour, unless Gotenks spent 28 minutes talking to Piccolo that is, then he is as fast as the speed of light.

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Buutenks

[quote user="demonkingpiccolo"][quote user="Buutenks"]
What do you think Gotenks did in those 26-27 minutes?(26-27 because he's only half saiyan so he can't survive in space using his full speed for more than 2 minutes).Gotenks made his trip in 1 minute or less(because like I said he can't survive in space using his full speed more than a minute),so what do you think he did in the remaning 26-27 minutes?


Goku can go over islands in one second,it means that he can go with 10 km/s.So he can easily go around the world,one time in 29 minute,now kaio-ken 20 Golu can fly 20 times faster than that,so it means that he can go with 200 km/s.So it would take him 1-2 minutes to go around the world one time.


[/quote] The distance that Goku traveled to escape Frieza's imprisonment ball explosion is not a confirmable distance, and is NEVER mentioned. It is also NEVER stated how long it took him to get from the Explosion area back to the area that Gohan, Krillin, Piccolo, and Frieza were at. Therefore you can't come up with that theory of 10 km/s, and be able to prove it.
I think the evidence of Gotenks's speed lies in the time it took Piccolo to catch up with him. Piccolo by the Buu saga had far surpassed Super Saiyan Goku in the Frieza saga, and judging by your theory on Goku's speed in the Frieza saga, and then comparing it to Piccolo's speed in the Buu Saga, even if it took Gotenks only a few seconds to go around the world a couple dozen times, Piccolo could've caught up with him in about 1 second when he stopped to take a nap.
In other words, going by your theory (Based on your Gotenks Theory, and your comparison of Goku and Piccolo theory), it would've taken Piccolo at most 5 seconds to catch up with Gotenks after he stopped. Why? Because remember the math I did, you can roughly fly around the Earth 6.2 times if you actually flew at the speed of light, giving piccolo plenty of time to catch up with Gotenks. But Gotenks states that he only circled the Earth a few dozen times, not the 111,600 times that he could have. But by the time Piccolo found him (Assuming that Piccolo could travel faster then Goku during the Frieza saga) It would've taken Piccolo about a second to catch up with Gotenks.
So your arguement is flawed:
*Gotenks states that he only circled the Earth several dozen times, not the 111,600 times that he could have in his half hour.
* Piccolo could've caught up with Gotenks in about a second if you go with your theory of him being faster then Goku during the Frieza saga (assuming that he is considering that Buu Saga Piccolo is far stronger then Frieza saga Super Saiyan Goku).
*If Gotenks truly was as fast as the speed of light, "a few dozen times" (official statement from Gotenks himself) would only consist of a few seconds. And considering that Piccolo could catch up with Gotenks in about a second (Based of the Theory of comparing him to Frieza saga Goku), roughly only 3-10 seconds would've passed from the time that Gotenks started flying to the time that Piccolo caught up with him. But Piccolo clearly states that he had less then a minute before Gotenks became Goten and Trunks again, so where did the 28 minutes go?
My theory: Gotenks bluffed when he said that he took a nap, in order to glorify himself and brag to Piccolo about his speed. One second is hardly enough time to settle down and even close your eyes. Part 2 of My theory: Gotenks is fast, but nowhere near light speed. The intervals of time from Gotenks' first take off, to Piccolo's catching up with him are WAY too close to fit as comfortably as they did in the half hour, unless Gotenks spent 28 minutes talking to Piccolo that is, then he is as fast as the speed of light.
[/quote]

Goku went over islands in a couple of seconds.Now Goku outran a explosion.Kaio-ken 20 Goku can fly 20 faster than that and ssj Goku 50 times faster.



I say that when they move in battle they move way faster than they fly,that's the only explanation why they move so fast in battle that Vegeta or Trunks can't see ssj Goku moving,but Vegeta could easily see Imperfect cell stage 2 move,who is way faster than #17,who is way faster than #18 who is way faster than ssj vegeta who is way faster than ssj Goku who is faster than Freez,who is way faster than kaio-ken 20 Goku who is 20 times faster than Goku who's faster than guys that can fight at sonic speedskid Goku moving faster than the eye could see,Goku being much faster than that etc) .So they move in battle way faster than they can fly,do you agree?I mean most of their feats are in battle,they never have flying feats like Superman flying from earth to the other side of the galaxy and back in a blink of an eye,their feats are showed when they fight.
The Gotenks feat doesn't prve anything and doesn'ty contradict anything,it's just a feat,you can't tell how fast he was flying nor how much time it took him to do it.Saying that it took him 28 minutes because he had only 1 minute left doesn't prove anything because Gotenks can't breath in space,so he must've made his trip in one minute or less.

And it can be that Gotenks made his trip in 1 minute or less and then the rest of the part wasn't shown in the manga.For e.e.g Gotenks went to fight Fat Buu in one panel and in the next one he comes back all beat up,now I doubt he fought Fat Buu and came back in one second.So you see the same is with ssj Gotenks,he made his trip in one minute or less and the rest of it wasn't showed.

And I doubt Gotenks was bluffing when he said that he took a nap,this is because he can't breath in space so he made his trip in just one minute or less,now there were 27 minutes left,so it means that he slept for those 27 minutes and had only one minute left.Or you could say that he was doing something else in those 27 minutes.But it doesn't matter,the fact that he's only half saiyan and that he can't breath in space means that he can't survive in space more than 1 minute or 2 because he would have died.So I say that he wasn't bluffing when he said that he took a nap because then what did he do in those 27 minutes?
Out of the Gotenks thing you can't do anything about it,Gotenks could have went in 1 second and he could have taken a nap or something like that,no time was told,so trying to prove that he was going that fast is pointless because in there is no real way in proving it.So I'm not arguing anymore.

And I like to add that Mr. Popo said that he can move at the speed of lightning,now this is moving not flying over long distances.So I say that their fighting speed is way faster than their flying speed.I believe that they move faster in battle than they fly because every time when they fight,they move at teleporting speeds and no one can see them(not even the z-fighters),but they can see them when they fly.I say that they can move for short distances way faster than they can fly.Do you agree?And lets drop the Gotenks thing,okay?Because it will not get us anywhere.We are both right in our own ways.

So lets just drop it,okay?
So like I said,they can move for short distances way faster than they would for long distances.Probably that's why it took Gotenks 1 or 2 minutes to make his trip and that's why it took Piccolo 28 minutes to find him,or to catch up.But still only Toriyama can tell how much time it took Gotenks to make his trip.


Edit:And what about my posts with Freeza flying so fast that rocks were being ripped?How fast do you need to fly to do that?And there are more scenes like that in the Freeza saga,there are two or three more.
Please limit your thoughts to one post per response. -The Chibi Kiriyama

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

SaiyajinPerfection

All I'm saying is that Piccolo could've caught up with him in WAY less then 28 minutes. (Or 27, whatever). Maybe two minutes at the most.
*No change from Super Saiyan when he laid down to the time he jumped up when Piccolo arrived (Which makes it a possibility that he bluffed about the nap).
*The time it took Piccolo to catch up with him is WAY too long (considering Gotenks only circled the Earth a few dozen times, which would've taken him only a few seconds), which suggests that Gotenks in nowhere near the speed of light while flying; fighting, yes I agree. I said a while ago that I thought the only light speed occurred when fighting and traveling short distances.
I'm only presenting evidence. I will drop this matter now, but I want other users to see this so they can formulate their own opinions.

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Buutenks

[quote user="demonkingpiccolo"] All I'm saying is that Piccolo could've caught up with him in WAY less then 28 minutes. (Or 27, whatever). Maybe two minutes at the most.
*No change from Super Saiyan when he laid down to the time he jumped up when Piccolo arrived (Which makes it a possibility that he bluffed about the nap).
*The time it took Piccolo to catch up with him is WAY too long (considering Gotenks only circled the Earth a few dozen times, which would've taken him only a few seconds), which suggests that Gotenks in nowhere near the speed of light while flying; fighting, yes I agree. I said a while ago that I thought the only light speed occurred when fighting and traveling short distances.
I'm only presenting evidence. I will drop this matter now, but I want other users to see this so they can formulate their own opinions.
[/quote]

Yep..I say that Piccolo can atleast fly with 200-300 km/s at max speed.I mean ssj Goku(from the Freeza saga) can probably fly with 160 km/s.This is because normal Goku went over a couple islands in 2-3 seconds,that's 4-5 km/s now ssj Goku is 50 times stronger and vegeta wentin 2-3 minutes from Piccolo's temple to where Imperfect Cell was destroying those islands.So I say he went 3,000 km seeing how Imperfect cell went in one direction for a couple of minutes and Piccolo's temple is above a country.

And normal Gohan without flying nowhere near his max went 6,000 km in 20 minutes.It is 6,000 km because a girl in Gohan's class stated that it takes a jet 5 hours to get to where Gohan lives.But she also said that it's over 1,000 km but I guess that was a mistake because i doubt a jet flies with 300km/hor maybe she just meant that it's over 1,000 km not that the distances is 1,500 km for example or 1,700 km.Maybe she just meant that it's over 1,000 km and that's it,yeah this is what I think she meant.
I wasn't trying to say that they could fly at the speed of light just because normal Gohan can fly without using his full speed 6,000 km in 20 minutes,I'm just trying to say that even though they can't fly at the speed of light they can fly very fast.

Edit:And Freeza was flying so fast that rcoks were being ripped and Vegeta was flying so fast that rocks were ripped also.

I don't know how fast you need to fly to do that but I say that must be over mach 40.
Again, a friendly reminder about double-post avoidance. -The Chibi Kiriyama

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

SaiyajinPerfection

I think Krillin after he'd had his powers awakened by the Namek Elder could break rocks when he flew as well. I always thought that effect was from their rapid Ki auras, not their speed. But I could be wrong......
EDIT: I say that it's hard to tell, I believe that Gotenks was extremely fast. But I don't think that even Vegetto could manage light speed by simply flying, fighting yes, I believe it is easy for them to accomplish light speed in close combat (I actually believe that light speed fighting was mastered by the Saiyan saga, Piccolo told Gohan to watch the light from a character's energy because Yamcha and the Saibaman were too fast to see with the naked eye). I think that to the untrained eye, it appears to be light speed, but it actually isn't. If a character hasn't been trained to see the light from their opponent's blasts or aura, they would be in serious trouble.

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Buutenks

[quote user="demonkingpiccolo"]I think Krillin after he'd had his powers awakened by the Namek Elder could break rocks when he flew as well. I always thought that effect was from their rapid Ki auras, not their speed. But I could be wrong......
EDIT: I say that it's hard to tell, I believe that Gotenks was extremely fast. But I don't think that even Vegetto could manage light speed by simply flying, fighting yes, I believe it is easy for them to accomplish light speed in close combat (I actually believe that light speed fighting was mastered by the Saiyan saga, Piccolo told Gohan to watch the light from a character's energy because Yamcha and the Saibaman were too fast to see with the naked eye). I think that to the untrained eye, it appears to be light speed, but it actually isn't. If a character hasn't been trained to see the light from their opponent's blasts or aura, they would be in serious trouble.
[/quote]

Actually,no Krillin wasn't destroying rocks because of his speed,only Vegeta and Freeza did this and the rocks were being ripped because of their speed not aura.They fly so fast past the rocks that the rocks are braking.

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

Super_17

I haver to say some of those characters in dbz can fly faster or as fast as speed of light.

Take for example the fight between majin vegeta and Goku. They see how fast they were moving as they were fighting. They were bouncing around in the air in a blink of an eye.

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params7

Buutenks, I have visually CONFIRMED the scene, believe me, I just saw the complete Freeza saga, the scene where King Kai says Freeza and Goku are too fast for him to locate happens.

Buutenks

[quote user="params7"]Buutenks, I have visually CONFIRMED the scene, believe me, I just saw the complete Freeza saga, the scene where King Kai says Freeza and Goku are too fast for him to locate happens.
[/quote]


Really?Well I saw the whole ssj Goku vs Freeza fight and the only scene where King Kai's antennas explode is when Goku fires a kameha at 100% Freeza.But maybe I missed something,so if you say so I'll believe you.

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Legendary Super Saiya-Jin



No one can stand up to Cell....

Modor

[quote user="Buutenks"][quote user="params7"]Buutenks, I have visually CONFIRMED the scene, believe me, I just saw the complete Freeza saga, the scene where King Kai says Freeza and Goku are too fast for him to locate happens.
[/quote]


Really?Well I saw the whole ssj Goku vs Freeza fight and the only scene where King Kai's antennas explode is when Goku fires a kameha at 100% Freeza.But maybe I missed something,so if you say so I'll believe you.
[/quote]It's in episode 83: A Final Attack, a short while after Frieza reached his maximum power.
King Kai: "Huh?! Unbelievable! This has never happened before! They're moving so fast that even I can't follow their motions!"