JAIF

A filler episode is still a filler episode. I'm sorry, but they have no ground whatsoever in canon discussions. In nigh every anime series (I know) fillers completely screw up the power balance, and Bleach is no exception actually.

I didn't say that he should... die by that attack, but he should have gotten far more serious injuries than getting his hand cut if he had taken the blast head-on.

Evil Dark Knight

Fine. Disregard the filler instance, since it does disarrange the power balance. - But use it as a visual example as to how Byakuya can combat using his weapon (including its techniques) and kidou attacks.

Yes, Byakuya would suffer severe damage if he were to collide head-on with Getsuga Tenshou. However, Ichigo would suffer similar damage if he were to collide with a kidou attack such as Soukatsui, or Byakurai. (Intensified damage if the incantation is used)

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JAIF

Renji managed to generally avoid Hadou #33 - Soukatsui, by his own admittion, and even though he was in Bankai, the gap between him and Byakuya (shikai) was still quite noticeable. Ichigo (post-Bankai training) is evidently much superior to Renji, and thus I can conclude he would be able to largely avoid the blast.

Either way, disregarding kidou and Getsuga Tenshou, it is still the most probable conclusion that Ichigo (shikai) > Byakuya (shikai).

Evil Dark Knight

That statement is rather biased. Defeating a captain level with (possibly more than) a thousand years of battle experience. Also, a user of Binding Arts that could play a major role in obtaining victory. - Rikujoukourou, to be more precise. Even if Ichigo is able to break free, it will take him a few moments to gather enough strength to do so, but within that time; Buyakya is at an advantage.

-180 degree turn-

Ichigo do not need hastened speed in order to defeat Byakuya. When it comes down to the final attack, Ichigo will merely pour all his energy into one attack and destroy Byakuya's sword again, resulting in victory.

-180 degree turn-

The question is, will Byakuya be able to defeat him before he is able to do such a thing, using his speed (As he did in Senkei when Ichigo began slowing down).
Knowing Ichigo has more spiritual energy and therefore has the edge in strength, I doubt Byakuya would find it favourable to settle the battle using strength alone (after experiencing a loss once). Before Ichigo decides to close the curtain with a final attack, Buyakuya would probably defeat him using some sort of tactic.

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SS2 Vegeto

JAIF answers the first part for me. The notion that he just took it head on, and suffered a minor cut, and Ichigo was all fine and confident, is extremely out there. He was..shocked..but that doesn't mean he couldn't dodge it. He was shocked because...that's freaking strong. Nothing else is revealed, or implied, that's..all. To assume any further is rather baseless. And..yeah, the blades did approach Ichigo in the shape of a coil, and we see clearly that they are standing on two points of uplifted rock facing each other in a straight line, and as the gash left in soukyoku hill indicates, the getsuga tenshou cut straight forward. The fact that it passed Byakuya's hand indicates that..he moved.

But that quote doesn't have any relevance to that. It doesn't indicate anything of the sort. I mean, we all know Ichigo didn't beat him down and force him to release in self-defense, but it doesn't mean any less that Ichigo's power made it ultimately necessary. The burden of proof is always on the one trying to prove something, rather than disprove. There isn't any canon evidence that Byakuya had the upperhand in that situation. The fact that Ichigo countered Byakuya's shikai effortlessly with his own ability, shocked Byakuya with his power, and displayed such confidence afterwards, would suggest that the advantage was his, were we not shown anything else that might cast doubt on the..initial implications of this, and we weren't. Nothing about either of their behaviours afterwards made anything else apparant. This is manga. If something is suggested, by words, or a situation, and stands uncontradicted, it stands as a valid representation of..whatever. As for thinking he could take on bankai Byakuya? Ichigo says himself: "I was stupid to think...I could beat a bankai with a shikai." And although this also proves that Ichigo has a lousy ability to gauge power, from the way he acted, there's no way anyone shouldn't be able to tell for sure that they weren't stronger than shikai ability in their opponent's case, if they figured they were put in a range to compete with a state 5-10x greater than shikai. Ichigo might be clueless, but he's not stupid. Even if you could think of some way to make sense of it, it isn't actually implied anywhere, so it lacks the canon backing to support it.

He barely had time to avoid the strikes by leaping upwards, and Hollow Ichigo was already behind him at that point - and again, dispite the advanced recovery rate in that state, Hollow Ichigo was still making use of a drained and injured body. Furthermore, we don't know how much spiritual power getsuga tenshou consumes - we know that the bankai variation can only be used a few times (prior to controlling his hollow powers), because of Hollow Ichigo's influence. Ichigo explains, "The black getsuga tenshou is that guy's attack. When I use that, I draw him out sooner...at most, I can fire two or three more times without completely losing control...". Grimmjow notes that it damages his own body, from the look of him, and that he could only put out two or three more of those, which is in line with Ichigo's explanation. We know from his explanation, that Hollow Ichigo is the reason using it consecutively puts him in such a condition. The normal getsuga tenshou has no such revealed limits. Common sense dictates that without such problems, it could be used quite a number of times more, however, the point is, we don't know how much spiritual power getsuga tenshou consumes, and thus, it can't be used as an argument, because one cannot support anything with facts that do not exist. In fact, it's not even stated that it consumes a lot of spiritual power. Ichigo states the following, quote on quote: "At the moment of attack...it consumes my spirit energy...and fires a super high concentration of spiritual pressure from the tip of my blade. Then the attack...is magnified and discharged." Nothing about "a lot" of power, or "a large portion of power". Finally, once more, Byakuya calls getsuga tenshou slow while using bankai. He narrowly avoided a direct hit at shikai.

And I don't get all this speed business. Ichigo learned to shunpo over training (and having speed focused abilities, predominantly, in bankai, I'm sure he knows a thing or two about moving fast properly), and was easily faster than Byakuya at unreleased state. I don't see anything that shows that Ichigo would be unable to keep up with Byakuya at shikai, so I don't really know where this assumption is coming from. All I know is that the manga paints a picture that shows Ichigo looking like he has the upper hand - and I have no reason to find reasons to doubt it, if Tite Kubo doesn't look like he's trying to paint a different picture.

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Evil Dark Knight

That may be true. However, that does not necessarily indicate that he lacks the speed to dodge it completely. Though this is nothing more than an assumption based on a personal opinion, it could be that he dodged the moment Ichigo released his attack, but the amplified spirit energy covered a larger area than he anticipated and therefore was scratched as it passed by. In other words, it was not viewed as essential to move a greater extent away from the attack, thus, his facial expression displayed surprise as Getsuga Tenshou magnified and even managed to harm him after he evaded. - Nothing more than my opinion. It's the same as saying Byakuya couldn't dodge it, or he was too slow.

Regardless of the huge power difference between Ichigo and Renji, - Renji was able to stop Byakuya before he was able to release his thousand blades, said/displayed confidence and yet it did not raise his chances of winning one bit.

Byakuya has a speed increase when he uses bankai?

I'm going to need some photographic proof. - An incident where that is stated/impled/displayed.

Ichigo Always looks like he has the upper hand. - It's what pissed Grimmjow off. Also, Byakuya does not look like he was at a disadvantage. His expression remained the same throughout the entire shikai battle. (Excluding moment Ichigo released Getsuga Tenshou)

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