Cableguy15

Lol, you don't have to post everything in caps ANB. I can read normal print just fine.

The evidence that completely overules that is that he saw their A-class powers up close and wasn't the least bit worried... He sat there and waited for them to attack like they were nothing special.

He never admitted anything lol. Don't make things up. He sat there and waited for two A-classes to attack him like they were nothing compared to him.

You need to go take a second look at the scans, because it's made very clear that everyone got their A-class power up after Yusuke died, and that's why it happened. It has nothing to do with the energy from the makai or whatever it is you're talking about.

Obviously they know A-class isn't enough to defeat an S-class, so of course they'd try to reach S-class.

What are you even talking about? The Makai's "aura" has nothing to do with Hiei and Kurama's A-class power up. It was Yusuke's death. It's made crystal clear so I'm not really sure where you're getting that idea from.

And you're ignoring an important fact.
Yu Yu Hakusho 146 page 07 | One Manga
Yu Yu Hakusho 146 page 08 | One Manga

Sensui is not afraid to fight two A-class demons charging at him. That fact alone overules your entire argument of saying he can't handle A-class fighters through indirect statements when he makes it perfectly clear that Hiei and Kurama were no big deal to him.

Lol, what are you talking about? I never mentioned anything involving Kazuya (And by the way, that was actually Minoru), I was talking about when Hiei and Kurama charged him and Sensui just sat on top of the tv, casually waiting for them to attack, and most certainly wasn't afraid.

You have the nerve to tell me I'm ignoring facts when you write off Sensui blatantly not being afraid of A-class Hiei and Kurama as him just being "Cocky"? It's only "Cocky" when it proves your theory wrong, am I right? :/

Your entire argument relies so much on this, which is wrong anyway. Like I said before, Hiei and Kurama becoming A-class has nothing to do with the makai. It was Yusuke's death, and nothing suggests otherwise.

No, I do realize that. What you don't realize is that they couldn't have gotten their A-class power ups without Yusuke's death occuring: Yu Yu Hakusho 144 page 18 | One Manga
Yu Yu Hakusho 144 page 19 | One Manga

Saying that it somehow happened because of the makai (Which not only is there no proof of, the fact that Air instantly makes them stronger makes no sense.) would mean Yusuke did that for nothing. Everything shown points to their power ups being because of Yusuke's death.

Lol, something isn't a fact because you want it to be ANB, because the fact is, Sensui had no worries whatsoever about two A-classes charging him. He just sat there casually. It renders any argument you try to throw in completely useless. He can handle 3 A-classes at less that 1/5 power. That fact that he put armor on means almost nothing considering he was still suppressed (Looking at his fight with Yusuke) and didn't even need to move to beat them.

Yes. He. Can. And that will never change no matter how much you try to write off Sensui not being afraid of Hiei and Kurama charging him.

And... Er... I never even said anything about Planets or plains of existence... What are you talking about anyway? :/

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ANB

Lol, bad-habits that grew from dealing with hard-heads and fanboys. I'll try to keep it down a bit.

He was still surprised by their power. "Oh-ho" with an exclamation mark.

He admitted it [That he couldn't handle all of them with only 1/5th] when Itsuki WARNED him to kill Yusuke and he DID. This is something you are ignoring.

Okay, it makes sense.

All I was saying was that they had no true intention to train. When Yusuke was a live, sure, and it was a clever scheme but Itsuki saw through it. However, after Yusuke died, they decided to go down fighting. Not one of them attempted to escape and even dragged Sensui to Makai so they could go all-out. They wanted to die, as Kuwabara said, "in a blaze of glory".

Sensui does not want to fight three A-classes with only a FIFTH of his power. That's why he agreed with them to go to Makai: Powering up anymore would destroy the planet.

In fact, here we see Sensui behind the barrier to hide from them:

Yu Yu Hakusho 146 page 14 | One Manga
Yu Yu Hakusho 146 page 15 | One Manga
Yu Yu Hakusho 146 page 16 | One Manga

Sensui is afraid of having to fight them with only a 5th. That's why he intentionally snuck behind the barrier. Fact of the matter is: He can't power-up more than a 5th unless he's in Makai. So maybe it's not so much "cowardice", but being smart and strategic. Actually, that's one reason I like Sensui (as surprising as this may sound). He's sweet, but I don't like people exaggerating his strength without reason and crediblity.

Lol, it certainly can be cockyness. I'm not mad about anything being disproven.

This entire paragraph is flat-out wrong. Before anyone even got a chance to throw a punch, Sensui powered-up hugely:

Yu Yu Hakusho 147 page 09 | One Manga
Yu Yu Hakusho 147 page 10 | One Manga

"I'll take this battle seriously,", that, not to mention the fact he powered-up by a huge amount proves he can't handle all three of them with only a 5th. Otherwise...he'd just stay suppressed. And he didn't. Again:

-Agreeing with them to go to Makai, where he'd be more comfortable.
-Huge power-up
-Taking them "seriously"

The fanboys who claim when he said he can't power-up more than a 5th, it means he'd destroy the entire dimension of humans. I have read scans, including the one you have, that simply say "Earth" or "Planet". You only need a power-level of 18,000 to destroy a planet, so...

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Cableguy15

Seeing as you've posted on Narutofan before, it's understandable lol.

The way he said it was very condicending. He didn't even look worried. I'm not sure if either Hiei or Kurama have an attack that could get past Sensui's Seikou-ki anyways. The Black Dragon couldn't even get past his aura, and I doubt Kurama has any attacks on that level.

I'm not ignoring it. I ackknowledge it... As something that's overuled by Sensui openly not being afraid of Hiei and Kurama attacking him. It completely counters the "He listened to Itsuki" argument because before he was supposedly "Afraid" to face an unknown "Threat" (Hiei and Kurama as A-class demons), but when he saw that "Threat" up close he was not afraid, or bothered by it.

Them reaching A-class is impossible without Yusuke's death taking place. So there's no need for Hiei to say Itsuki "Got them" if Hiei was just going to go out there and die (Not as an A-class) rather than escape and train like Itsuki had guessed. The reason they wanted to "Go out in a blaze of glory" at that point was because Sensui killed Yusuke, therefore they wanted to kill him. Had Yusuke not died, escaping and training would have been the first priority.

Don't you remember how Sensui said he wanted to die in the makai? He just wanted to go there. It has nothing to do with how much power he's limited to in the human world.

... To hide from them? lol That's ridiculous. He has no reason to hide when he's in the space between the two world anyway (Going by your theory), since it's likely powering up there wouldn't damamge anything. Either way, he wasn't hiding from them, he was using the barrier to his advantage. To trick Kuwabara into cutting it down as a "Gift" to the demons (As Sensui later describes it).

It can be... If you can prove it. Didn't say you were mad, I'm just saying that you shouldn't make excuses for something that disproves your case. Saying "Oh, he was just cocky" really doesn't make a good case.

Remember how you said I was "Sound biting" before? You're doing the same thing now with Sensui. He said he would take them seriously despite knowing they would have absolutely no chance, meaning he doesn't need full power (And by the looks of it, anything close to it) to beat them. he even says that the only reason he would take them seriously was because they were motivated by Yusuke's death. It had nothing to do with whether he could handle them at less than 1/5 of his power or not.

Lol, they are fanboys then. He specifically says "Put too much stress on the planet". He never says anything about plains of existance or destroying anything for that matter.

I'd say Sensui is well over 18,000 based on Kaio-Ken Goku's shockwave and his. (As you can see earlier in this thread.)

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ANB

Although this plot-device is true, in your case it's a cop-out arguement. He'd be able to access his power there; very simple. Maybe it's both. Maybe it's fate. Maybe it's Maybellene. :/

Uh, imho, he certainly was hiding from them.

And if he wasn't then he was taking advantage of it. Why stay on the other side where the enemy can't hit you...? Hell, Sensui was the one to point it out and then went on to inflate his ego about how his ki is "Divine" and can pass right through it.

I still think he can't handle three A-classes with only 20%. It was ideal to go to Makai where he wouldn't have to be so tense and could have fun. And he wanted to go there anyway ;)

Sensui's is similar to Freeza in that he's cocky, but he has a reason to be. Remember when Yusuke said he was going to beat his ass in the hospital shortly after hearing that the gate would open "in two days"...? Sensui said "beat me...? Sometimes you say the strangest things,". A bit of an ego there if I didn't know better. Then again...there are 7 of them lol.

He still power-UP. And they took punishment from him for several panels. Hiei even exchanged blows and was sent reeling with a punch to the gut. I'm not saying he was using...even 50%, okay...? But he still powered-up to fight three A-classes. It makes sense, and it was in congruence with his openly stating "I'll take you seriously". Not all-out, but he was going to be respectfull and power-up a little. I don't see why he wouldn't just use the same suppression (1/5th) as he was in Ningenkai if it wouldn't make a difference [Beating their arses either way]. Catch my drift...?

1-Yep, fanboys. Now that you agree, I'm not letting G-Lord or SS2 say anything about their precious "translations". Besides, they can't say anything if Viz contradicts the notion.

2-Simple math. Sensui might be twice as strong as Kaio-ken Goku with 20% (1/5th). 48,000 is what comes up and multiplying we have 192,000 at full-power. Maybe he's three or even four times as strong as Goku [when suppresed]; but he's certainly not in the millions.

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Cableguy15

How's it a cop out argument? It disproves you... Again and also again you deny it by writing it off because it doesn't fit your theories :/

He stayed on the other side because he wanted Kuwabara to cut down the barrier. That was his plan from the very begining, and though he admits in the end that wasn't his overall plan he still says it's what he wanted as a "Gift" for the demons. Because like I said, there's no reason for him to "Hide" even going by your theory of him not being able to handle 3 A-classes at once with limited power since he can still power up in a place that is not on Earth (The space between planes).

If he was afraid of them, why would he just stand there waiting for Kuwabara to cut down the barrier? It would be more smart to go into demon world before the barrier was cut down, if it were like you said. But instead he stood there and taunted Kuwabara to the point where he cut it down. What does this tell us? Sensui was only showing himself on the other side of the barrier so Kuwabara would cut it down and a great deal of his plan would be complete. If he stayed on the same side of the barrier as Kuwabara and the others were he would have ended up killing him, giving the human world a chance to live since no A or S class would be able to make it through.

Eh? Sensui is nothing like Freeza lol. Freeza would have taken his time killing Yusuke no matter what Itsuki said. At the hospital? That would be Minoru anyway, though I don't remember them fighting at a hospital...

As I said before:
Meaning that he either overestimated their powers and then saw it was something he could handle limited, needed a push from Itsuki (He was hesitating after all), or just didn't want to take risks in general.

He explains it perfectly himself. He says he normally wouldn't take them seriously, and even thought it was shameful, but because they were motivated by Yusuke's death he took them seriously. He did get stronger, but not because they were too much for him to handle. He makes that pretty clear.

Well they use that same bad translation that says Raizen shook the makai, when there's actualy more occassions than one that proves that the most he shook was his country (Or demon world territorry), so I wouldn't trust it anyway.

Actually it was at his full power that he made the shockwave, so it's even less than that. I think 45,000-90,000 is a good guestimation

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ANB

It works both ways, really. You can't say that he didn't ALSO want to go to Makai so that he could be more comfortable fighting. And there are mountains of evidence for this too, so it's not like I'm coping-out. We're both right, but we're interpreting it differently ;)

He was hesitant because he could sense Yusuke's inner demon potential.

And if he took the initiative then it was, as you said, a risk. And if it's a risk he is apparently threatened by it.

Does. Not. Work.

If he could have pwned all of them with only 20% he should have just stayed that way. And it proves something that they took punishment from him for two chapters while he was powered-up.

In other words: They had to be stronger than him at 20% to live through that hell (By DBZ's standards, anyone 1.5x weaker gets shredded like paper with one good hit). Again, it can easily be both reasons and there is plenty of evidence to support either.

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Cableguy15

But it's like I said before. It was the threat of the unknown that may have worried him, but when he saw their powers up close and personal, he was by no means worried anyway.

But he explains the exact reason. If it really was because they were too much for him to handle, why didn't he include it in his explaination for why he was taking them seriously?

He wasn't even trying when he fought them. There's no way they took the full force of his blows. A full powered punch from Sensui would leave nothing left of them.

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ANB

He didn't need to include it; his powering-UP is self-explanatory.

Anytime anyone in any shonen says "let's get serious" they power-UP. It's like...freaking tradition and you being a DBZ fan should know that. This is the same case.

Except, he can't use a full powed punch because he's not AT full-power. He powers up to say, 40% because that is just outside their reach. We know he wasn't at full power because he powers up again with Yusuke and he clearly states that it's a "strength-enhancing" maneuver. We know he can't still be at 20% because again: he powered-up.

Let me put it this way:

When Toguro fought Genkai, he started out at 45%. At that level, Genkai's rei-gun blew a hole right through his arm and it nearly fell-off. He himself said it "wasn't respectful to fight while this low" and powered up to 80%. At 80, Genkai could die from even one good, clean punch. At 45, she could dodge his attacks and even land a few hits. The difference is this: Someone who is pulling their punches while powered-up is going to hurt more than someone pulling their punches while powered-down. Even if Sensui isn't trying at 40%, like even just a love-tap, it'll sting much longer than a love-tap at a lower-percentage. It's that simple.

------------------------------------------------------------

And about the Makai thing, it was ideal to go where he'd have access to his full-power. If he stayed in Ningenkai he wouldn't be able to give Hiei, Kurama and Kuwabara a "respectable" fight. And in my opinion, he couldn't because they'd either A) Be dead-even and he's be vulnerable or B) Weaker than them. But you say "he wasn't worried". You have to put the scene in context:

-Sensui crushes Yusuke. He then sits down on the TV waiting for the hole to open.
-Kuwabara breaks the barrier. Kurama and Hiei reawken their powers.
-Sensui is surprised [i.e: off-guard] by how much stronger they became due to Yusuke's death.
-While off-guard, and sitting on a TV, Hiei launches a black-dragon at him and pulls him through the barrier. Yes, he was still on the TV and is even in a sitting positition while being carried. Also, the Seikou-ki was protecting him.

So it wasn't exactly that he "wasn't worried" he was actually surprised by their new power and was hit immediately by Hiei's best attack. While chilling on a TV. And to top it off, it could easily just be cockyness because he probably knew the black-dragon couldn't get past his holy-ki. Despite this, it kept pushing him until he was dragged through the Kekkei and it evaporated while Sensui was filtered via divine-ki.

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Cableguy15

Not this one. He gives a specific reason that has nothing to do with them being a threat.

Hmm? I'm not denying that he powered up.

That example kind of works against your point, though I know you were talking about something else. Here's what I mean; Toguro says 45% wasn't respectful after Genkai blew a large chunk of his arm off, and then proceeds to power up to 80% as a show of respect. Sensui does the exact opposite against Hiei, Kurama, and Kuwabara (Minus the power up). Sensui says it would normally be shameful (Clearly because they were horribly outmatched to begin with) to take them seriously, but only because of their determination to avenge Yusuke would he take them "Seriously".

As you can tell, those are completely different reasons, as Hiei's attack had no effect at all, while Genkai's did, and Toguro powered up out of respect, while Sensui did it despite it being shameful.

Hiei's Black Dragon, clearly the strongest attack any of them possessed (Besides potentially the Dimension sword) couldn't even get past Sensui'sd aura. He wasn't afraid of Hiei and Kurama's power up close. It all adds up perfectly to him being too much for them to handle still.

Nope, he definitely wasn't off guard. He lacked the surprised or scared look. His comment "Oh Ho! That's definitely A-class power." was more him being slightly impressed, if not a little condisending. It doesn't matter how off-guard he is, he still would have shown some sign of being worried if he actually was. When in fact, he had an attitude like he didn't have a single worry in the world.

Ya, it couldn't get past his aura because the dragon was that much weaker. They were nowhere close to his level. Seems pretty obvious to me...

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ANB