G-lord

Tsukuyomi - Narutopedia, the wiki about Naruto - a Wikia wiki

Kitsune Lore

Tsukuyomi sounds a LOT like the Kitsune Seduction technique. If the "illusionary world" created by Tsukuyomi is actually all in the target's mind, I don't see too many beings without significant defences against mental attacks being able to defeat it. This is PURELY because the target would not know they are trapped in their mind (unless they possess multiple souls/bodies) and would not be able to do anything about it.

However, if Tsukuyomi's "illusionary world" is actually another dimension, then a lot of beings (including MANY DBZ fighters) would be able to escape it, as if someone like Super Buu just screams out of rage, I don't think Itachi would recognise it as a dimensional-ripping technique before it is too late.

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Fred

It's the former, clearly.

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G-lord

Yeah, that's what I thought. So this pretty much means the ability to make tears between dimensions irrelevant to this discussion, as Tsukuyomi is not something that can be escaped by making dimensional tunnels. But, just for the record, DBZ characters can make tears in and between dimensions. Also, if the Super Buuhan vs. Vegetto scene is in the Manga, then the higher tier DBZ fighters are capable of shattering dimensions as well.

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"Hail to the King, baby!"

Fred

The manga states that the only way Tsukiyomi can be dissolved is if Itachi dies while casting it, or someone else takes over the dimension with an Uchiha Blooded Sharingan, however, Tsukiyomi is easily avoided when it's directly used, and since Itachi lacks the strength speed to perform it indirectly in a combo, Tsukiyomi is pretty much irrelevant entirely.

I'm sorry to go against Nikushimi, since he invited me back in the topic, but the reflexes of Dragonball Characters is beyond the level of gods themselves. They could sense the wierd Chi/Chakra coming from Itachi's eyes, and avoid it. It's their nature, unless you get a cocky character like Vegeta to try and take it head on.

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G-lord

^I was about to mention the relevance of the overall combat speed and reflex speed of DBZ fighters myself. Has it already been discussed? The way I see it, if it is one of the more cautious Z fighters (like Piccolo), the Tsukuyomi technique could be avoided. However, if it is someone like Gotenks or Vegeta, I'm not as confident they could avoid it. Although this is only a movie character (and non-canon), Gogeta showed the focus of Goku: he just went into overkill mode and ended the fight.

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"Hail to the King, baby!"

Fred

Well Nikushimi's argument over it is that Tsukiyomi is instant, when it's not as instant as it would appear, because Kakashi knew it was coming before Itachi even opened his eyes.

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G-lord

^ I'm not going to touch that one with a ten-foot pole, as I lack sufficient knowledge, lol.

From what I know of the Tsukuyomi technique, it can alter the perception of the target whilst being cast. This could mean that even if they recognise the technique, they may already be under its spell. Hence, why it can be argued to be instantaneous. It can also be argued that the Tsukuyomi technique can be recognised before it is cast, as we don't know if the perception of the target was altered or not. This is where the argument that it is not instantaneous arises from.

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"Hail to the King, baby!"

Fred

When Kakashi was hit by him, he let it come because he thought he could take it because of his Sharingan. Sasuke was in the midst of defending himself both times it was used on him. The first time he was being held against the wall by Itachi, and the second time it was mid combo.

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Nikushimi

*swipes hand over head mockingly*

You missed completely. The dialogue reads "Ha ha ha! I don't know my own strong!". I was pointing out the fail'd nature of the scanslation.

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Originally Posted by ANB The scan where he blasts Gotenks and Piccolo says it would "sweep away the Earth without a trace" proves he could have put MORE chi into it. They could make their attacks a mile wide if they wanted. THAT'S THE POINT.

Call me crazy, but I didn't see that particular blast even rip a dimensional hole, did you? So...what does it matter if more Ki could be put into it?

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Originally Posted by ANB As for this "sealing" issue, lets look in the dictionary:

Now you're just being stupid. The word "seal" itself has a number of definitions; to "seal off" in the physical sense of blocking something is not the same as a magical seal. There is a big difference between the Totsuka no Tsurugi and saran wrap.

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Originally Posted by ANB 1-Tsukuyomi: An illusionary dimension created by Itachi. DBZ characters have been shown to be able to create holes in dimensions. The hole Super Boo made in the ROSAT lasted several seconds. For the record, Majin Boo blasted a hole immediately (realizing he was trapped, something Itachi would tell him like an idiot)and was unfocused so he could likely shatter the entire dimension. Regardless, when he realized there was a hole he took the initiative and escaped. It lasted several seconds. That window of opportunity would be enough to escape/break the jutsu.

I like how you just make shit up. Since when does Itachi tell his opponents how his Jutsu work? This does not include AFTER they've been buttfucked by them, fyi. In fact, when does he ever explain ANYTHING?

Anyway, here's something else: Have I mentioned that Tsukuyomi is fabricated completely by Itachi, since it is not actually occurring? Yes, I have. Have I mentioned that because it is not occurring in real time, Super Buu has basically no chance of doing jack shit unless he reached an immediate conclusion about what to do, and even then, he still has to outdo Itachi in the "skill" department, which is about as likely to happen as SSJ5Goku getting laid?

Tsukuyomi is not a physical dimension- it is a Genjutsu. It is an advanced Genjutsu where you experience whatever Itachi wants you to, in a world under his complete control. Unless you have some way of combatting that, you are fucked. Accept it already.

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Originally Posted by ANB 2-Amatseru: One of Itachi's most powerfull techniques. He must be using the mangekyou sharingan and must close his right eye for a moment to activate it. Sasuke was seen dodging the technique and we know that any DBZ character in the Vegeta saga or higher can move faster than Sasuke. Furthermore, Freeza can withstand the heat of a planetary explosion and Cell can withstand the heat of the sun (meaning: Anyone as strong as Cell could withstand Amatseru). Lastly, all forms of Majin Boo can regenerate from atoms and they would be able to recover from the damage of Amasteru.

The Jutsu's called "Amaterasu".

First of all, the Jutsu can't be dodged- stated by Itachi, Sasuke, AND Zetsu. Itachi didn't want to damage Sasuke's eyes, so he was trailing him with it trying to only catch a certain part of his body without coming to close to his head.

Heat-wise...he's causing you to combust, gaiz. He's literally setting shit on fire at a glance, and the flames burn anything. Furthermore, they continue to burn until their target is gone. Completely.

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Originally Posted by ANB 3-Susano'o: This recently revealed justu utelizes some sort of spirit to protect Itachi from damage. Although details of it are scarce, we know it has a strange immaterial spirit-sword that can seal opponents in a dimensional void forever. Like Tsukuyomi, DBZ characters in the Boo saga or higher can escape with a kiai. Goku, Cell, and Kid Boo also have instant transmission. With it, they can instantly appear anywhere in the universe by locking onto a chi source and teleporting.

Uh, this is obviously crap.

A seal is a seal; we don't know if an alternate dimension is involved, simply that you are sealed inside a spectral sake gourd. However, whatever is pierced by the Totsuka no Tsurugi is put into a dream-like state, in other words, you can't fight back. Think of it like a massive dose of bear tranquilizer.

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Originally Posted by ANB ......

Complete bullshit, for reasons I've already explained.

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Originally Posted by ANB Itachi likes to tell his opponents the details of his attacks and how they work...like a lot of characters in the series.

This seriously does not tickle my pickle. It's like you're trying your hardest to make shit up because you've run out of anything that even remotely resembles fact.

I also like how you make statements like this, yet get on my case when I say DBZ characters like to stand around talking and powering up. Especially when, you know, I'm right and you're wrong. :P

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Originally Posted by ANB Btw: Boo was sealed in the ball when he was Fat Boo who is far weaker than Super Boo. Furthermore, The ball isn't even a "dimension" so your arguement fails there kthnxbai.

A seal is a seal, and it was performed by someone far, far weaker than Buu (hell, Piccolo nearly killed that bitch with a single cockslap).

The ball doesn't need to be a dimension, btw. Dunno where you're pulling this from.




Fact: Itachi would force any DBZ character to perform fellatio on him and impale them through the head in the process. Think about it.

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SSJ5Goku

No. I will get laid, it's all a matter of who (that is NOT a man) does it.

Anyway, back to the topic on Vegito Vs. Itachi...

Vegito's PL has to be in the billions, maybe trillions. With the eyes, and only with the eyes, Itachi can match him. But what-if Itachi were blind from using the Tsukuyomi/Amateratsu so much? Answer: Vegito, Final Kamehameha, incinerates Itachi.

Now, with the eyes. Without a proper understanding of Itachi's eyes, Vegito will do lots of eye contact, talking about, and going Super Vegito while he's at it, unaware that he's caught in an illusion, which is really inside of Itachi's mind. A genjutsu should warp inside either the victim's or the user's mind. Fact is, Vegito doesn't know he's in one, and will likely end up strangling himself while having a vision of Super Buu coming to finish the job. But, Vegito's power alone, as SSJ, nearly gave Buu a through beating, and Vegito was just playing. So if Vegito were serious... Gohan-Buu would have been dead before Vegito busted out the Final Kamehameha. So, if Vegito could realize that that was a minor illusion or something like that, he could break free of most of Itachi's genjutsu.

Next, we have the Tsukuyomi, where it warps into the target's mind and lets him feel extreme pain. Super Vegito might already realize that he's trapped in the Tsukuyomi and struggle to break free. It's like rolling a 2-sided dice, Pass or Fail. Mostly, it will be failed. But wait! Most DBZ characters have escaped those kinds of situations (not genjutsu related, but otherwise tight spots) by powering-up. While Itachi may sense that his power is increasing and will tighten the restraints of Tsukuyomi so much that it'd look impossible to escape, through speculation, Vegito could either go full power and barely manage to break free of the trap or remain in there for the "72 hours", or ascend beyond Super Saiyan. (We know for sure he could go Super Saiyan 2, by pure speculation, but some speculators claim Vegito can go all the way to 3, but I'd place Vegito, at most, able to go SSJ2.) From there, he could quickly finish the job.

Finally, there's Amateratsu, an inescapable black flame attack that is cast simply by looking at a target. It destroyed even the inescapable "Toad Mouth Trap" of Jiraya. But, even if Vegito was caught in it, and stop-drop-rolling would not be effective, Vegito, with the pride of Saiyans, would probably just self-destruct, Final Explosion style. (If one of the fusees can use it, then why not the fusion?)

But suppose that Vegito was in the air. And I'm not sure Amateratsu can hit airborne targets. I'm sure Tsukuyomi can, but not Amateratsu. Vegito could try to spirit sword him. And, keep in mind, contrary to the belief of my arch nemesis on FF.net that Saiyans are slow, even if they turn Super Saiyan or higher, that SSJ transformations (except SSJ1 Stage 2 and Stage 3) increase speed and power. He could also warp behind Itachi with Instant Transmission and... fucking axeheel-kick him in half before Itachi could try anything else.

In conclusion, Vegito and Itachi would be a well-rounded match, but, depending on the luck and circumstances of what jutsu he's caught in, it could go either way. I still lean towards Vegito, though.

SSJ2 and SSJ3 Vegito were pure speculation, but SSJ2 Vegito would be as far as he could go for sure. SSJ3 Vegito is not only impossible, but that kind of power would break the planet in... two.

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The picture goes with something else I'm planning on doing (as soon as I make the Ed, Edd, n' Eddy sprites I need.)

Nikushimi

Sorry to tell you, but Sonic and Crash aren't real.

First of all, without Sharingan/Mangekyou Sharingan, Itachi gets cockstabbed through the chest. However, he has them in this match-up, and they function perfectly fine.

Second, god-like power does not instantly equate to overcoming Genjutsu. The principle is essentially the same as "No matter how strong a fighter you are, if you get the AIDs, you gonna die." Itachi's SharinAIDs are MAD HAX.

Third, when Amaterasu is on you, IT'S OVER HE WON. That's like saying "When I get hit with this nuke, IMMA FIRIN MAH LASER." No. You burn up, you die. Unless you're another yaoi-bait Uchiha with full PnJ activated. BTW, Itachi w/ full PnJ is literally unbeatable, srsly. He would just pull out his cock and Vegeto would die from the Reiatsu pressure- Itachi wouldn't even have to impale him with it.

Lastly, you're assuming Vegeto starts in the air, and that he goes FTW immediately. But also, for the record, Amaterasu can hit airborne targets. Whatever Itachi sets his eyes on "vanishes from this world".

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SSJ5Goku

They are still men though. =/ Not human men, but men. >_>;

This is why no one debates about Itachi anymore--people like you, Nikushimi. DBZ character's would own Itachi in a Taijutsu (hand-to-hand) and Ninjutsu (Energy Attack) only battle, but the instant all rules are thrown away, I hate to admit, but Itachi would decapitate Vegito with batting only an eye.

(Taijutsu and Ninjutsu only, Vegito > Itachi)

(All moves availible, Itachi > Vegito)

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The picture goes with something else I'm planning on doing (as soon as I make the Ed, Edd, n' Eddy sprites I need.)

Nikushimi

NOT ANYMORE, BETCH:

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Zer0

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